User Comments

1. 

   1/26/08

   suburbqueen

   Not that I like Hillary anyway, but who cares if the same family is in office? Shouldn't it be more important that they do a great job (same family or not)?

   [reply]
   1. 

      1/26/08

      ender

      so glad to see you out and about here again
   2. 

      1/26/08

      suburbqueen

      Thanks! It's good to be back.
   3. 

      4/26/08

      timethief

      IMO intelligent voters do not vote on the basis of either gender or color; they vote on the basis of who is the best candidate for the job. So thumbs up for suburbqueen.
   4. 

      4/26/08

      timethief

      IMO the "family" thing is as much a red herring as is the "woman" thing.
      Surely to goodness people in America cannot be as dull of wit as some bloggers seem to portray in this forum. The same people keep posting on the same subject and working the same angles like broken records.
      :rolling eyes skyward:
   5. 

      4/26/08

      timethief

      @barack
      I am a Canadian and I am not suffering the misogyny, racism and bigotry that you display in your original post above to be acceptable in any way shape or form so I'm speaking up loudly.
      
      (1) I find the fact that the only posts you have ever made to this forum have been based on misogynistic, bigoted and racist slurs against one candidate to be utterly offensive and shameful.
      
      (2) I find the fact that you appear to be unable to offer any substance to the dialog, such as being able to list and expand on the merits of the candidate that you support when you post on this issue to be the most offensive thing of all, because your are insulting our intelligence.
   6. 

      4/26/08

      gmoney

      I would have to say that race/gender will play into anyones choice..... maybe not as much as others issues, but I think that it still would play a part. We are all individuals and thinking that someone is more intelligent than someone else because they would not let race or gender enter into a decision is ludicrous.
2. 

   1/26/08

   ender

   not to mention, why do a headline about not voting for a white woman if it's really hillary you're ticked about?

   [reply]
   1. 

      1/26/08

      libdrone

      oh the title is definitely racist but since the poster is black are we Allowed to notice this?
   2. 

      1/26/08

      suburbqueen

      But to do so would be offensive...
   3. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      libdrone..... thanks for giving up my race!!! But for real, the headline was to grab attention. I am not ticked at Hillary, I just feel that you can not have progress with the same old ideas in office, hence the same 2 families in office for 20 years and possibly 24 years.
   4. 

      1/30/08

      africana

      you make it sounds as if Black people cannot be racist?
   5. 

      4/26/08

      kickdrum

      I agree! Why not just say "Don't vote for Clinton"? Your title is extremely racist to me. I'm certain you would never say "Don't vote for a black man." Even if you didn't like Obama. Be more considerate to white people, will you? 'White' is a race too, you know.
      
      It wouldn't hurt you to apologize to us Whites here.
3. 

   1/26/08

   libdrone

   I utterly loathe Hillary and my spouse is earnestly soliciting his New Zealand friends for someone to sponsor us as immigrants shoud she win...though honestly I can't see That happening.

   [reply]
   1. 

      1/26/08

      MadameX

      Alan, I'm no fan of Hillary Clinton, but I'm fascinated that you'd willingly hang out for two Bush terms and then bail if SHE were elected.
   2. 

      1/26/08

      libdrone

      I doubt seriously we will actually bail, and it is my spouse rather than me who is moved to act by This particular development. but I think I could easily make the case regardless of who the next pres is that things have come so far so wrong that immigrating is a sensible choice....
   3. 

      1/26/08

      acousticguitarist

      New Zealand is pretty, they try and speak English but leave out a few vowels. You'd have to study up on Rugby Union and the sheep out number the people. But the ice-cream is great. the people are very nice.
   4. 

      2/07/08

      SilverSpikes

      Hey - New Zealand's a pretty feminist country too. Our prime minister is female and she'll win the next election too (well I'll be voting for her). Don't come to NZ to run away – come cause you love the place!! This country was created out of no.8 wire - (and just a hint - chauvinism doesn’t do that well here – well that’s the message we want the world to hear). But thanks acoutistic – just added you as my friend.
4. 

   1/26/08

   mtchick

   Not sure about the "white" part in your post title, but I don't care if the same family has been in charge or not - it's their views on certain subjects that matter.

   [reply]
   1. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      sorry but the white part was simply for the shock value
5. 

   1/26/08

   bnsullivan

   It would be awfully nice if we (the electorate) would consider and vote for candidates based on their abilities to lead rather than on gender, race, skin color, ethnicity, or family name.

   [reply]
   1. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      Bnsullivan....... I was wondering how long it would take for someone to make the point that you just did. Thank you for having a open mind and seeing through the BS..... now with that said those things like it or not do matter
   2. 

      1/26/08

      suburbqueen

      That sounds like a really great idea...we should try that.
   3. 

      1/26/08

      MadameX

      Bobbie, I think that's something that is going to be possible only once the barriers have been broken. If you're a member of a race that has had to accept for generations that no one who looks like you is eligible (however unofficial that eligibility may be) to lead, I suspect the issue looks quite a bit different. The fact is that while it seems like race and gender have recently become big issues in the political process, they are actually coming into the public eye because they're lesser issues than they used to be. When race and gender were immediately dispositive and no one would ever in a million years have dreamed of suggesting that a woman or a black man could be President, there was no reason to talk about it.
   4. 

      1/26/08

      bnsullivan

      gmoney, what matters to me is merit.
   5. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      we should try this in life period not just when voting.... Think about not judging based on color?????
      People use the excuse based on preference but I think it more based on ignorance.
   6. 

      1/26/08

      bnsullivan

      Tiffany, I accept the points you raise. I said above, "It would be awfully nice if..."
   7. 

      1/26/08

      MadameX

      Gmoney, I agree with you, but there are apparently pitfalls to that, too. I think that I am for the most part entirely oblivious to race and have raised my daughter to be the same...not by telling her that it's not important and thus making an issue of it but simply by giving it the attention (none) that it deserves. I wrote a blog post about this a few months back: whatswrongaroundus.blogspot.com/2007/10/race-what-race-everybody-looks-same...
      
      But I've gotten some harsh reactions to my philosophy from members of various minority groups who think that seeing everyone without regard to race doesn't "respect their cultural differences" or "honor what they've been through".
   8. 

      1/26/08

      MadameX

      Gmoney, it's really interesting that your comment on my blog post directly contradicts what you've said here and reinforces the reaction I've gotten from other camps that only people who have never experienced discrimination would think race shouldn't be an issue.
   9. 

      1/28/08

      AngieA

      Don't apologize for the title "big G" it seems to have served it cause.
   10. 

       4/26/08

       kickdrum

       Yes it would be nice. BUT, people are voting for Obama solely based on his race. Nine out of 10 people voting for Obama couldn't tell you what his policy is. I've talked to white people that plan to vote Obama. Asked them why, they say they would feel racist if they didn't. That's not good for the country at all!
   11. 

       4/26/08

       timethief

       bnsullivan
       "It would be awfully nice if we (the electorate) would consider and vote for candidates based on their abilities to lead rather than on gender, race, skin color, ethnicity, or family name."
       
       IMO it would not only be "nice" it would also be intelligent.
6. 

   1/26/08

   MadameX

   Gmoney, it's kind of funny that you said that you weren't going to "release your choice" but that we "need a change...in color". That narrows the possibilities just a bit.

   [reply]
   1. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      MadameX.... I love the fact that you are sooooooooo smart. Really, I was waiting to see how long it would take for someone to pick that up!!! The white woman thing got more play than anything else so far... strange
7. 

   1/26/08

   ghostytwofish

   So, it's "not that I don't feel that a white woman should be president" ... but that you felt you could get some attention to your thread by utilizing some cheap race-baiting tactic. Nice.
   
   I'm strongly considering Obama for my vote, and it's certainly isn't because he's not a white woman. Dolt.

   [reply]
   1. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      Hey if CNN, FOX NEWS, GOLF weekly (see cover assets.espn.go.com/photo/2008/0117/pga_gw_covernoose_300.jpg) can use race baiting to sell advertising and magazines I can use it to get attention to a discussion. The title that I started with was 24 years of the same..... then went to dont vote for a woman and finally what it is now......
      not to offend, but it is funny that the title is getting more play than the topic.
   2. 

      1/26/08

      MadameX

      Well, now, wait a minute...are you honestly saying, "if someone else has done it, that makes it the right thing to do?"
   3. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      adding fuel to the fire. If it is white it is right..... how is that one going to go over GREAT.
      
      No it is not right at all.
      
      I am disappoint in myself but strangely pleased at the same time.
      But for the record I am NOT right to use race baiting as a ploy, but it is interesting to see what really matters to people...... the word white and woman is more important that a possible 24 year rule of 2 families.
   4. 

      1/26/08

      libdrone

      gaylon, stating that you are NOT going to use race-baiting as a ploy after you Already HAVE is kinda very meaningless
   5. 

      1/26/08

      Unfettered

      I think you're drawing, very purposefully, a dangerously wrong inference. Just because people object to your blatant race-baiting, doesn't mean it is MORE important to them than who winds up in the oval office.
      
      Just because you didn't get the reaction you desired, doesn't mean it's for the reasons you stated. After all, I could just as easily state that you are more concerned about keeping whitey out of the oval office than in who does a good job, but a cursory examination of your post and your views shows that not to be the case. Give other people the same credit for intelligence.
   6. 

      1/26/08

      ghostytwofish

      "But for the record I am NOT right to use race baiting as a ploy, but it is interesting to see what really matters to people......"
      
      Heh, you obviously think I'm an idiot.
   7. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      libdrone,
      
      I find it funny that the title is more important than the topic. It would be nice to see a person or color or even a woman in office. I mean come on Hillary or Obama cannot be any worse then the other presidents that we have seen in office. Please tell me why for over 200 years white men are the only ones qualified to be president..... let me change that, white men with money.
      
      I am not a angry black man.... I hate that race matters, but it does. I hate that people look at me different because of my skin tone...... I want change and this is the first year in a long time that someone that truly "APPEARS" different than the rest has some sort of chance. I don't care that he is black, but guess what..... it does help a little to me.
   8. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      ghostytwofish,
      
      the fact that you have intelligent thought... and you are part of blog catalog shows that you are smart my friend. I would never question your intelligence.
   9. 

      1/26/08

      MadameX

      Why do you assume that the title is "more important" than the topic just because someone commented on it? Obviously, every discussion involves a variety of sub-issues and tangential issues at varying levels of importance.
   10. 

       1/26/08

       ghostytwofish

       Well, good, G. Because I'm about to correct your post.
       
       You should have written approx. 50 years, and not over 200, concerning "white men with money." President Truman did not acquire any great wealth until (it is assumed) after he became a senator.
       
       en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_S._Truman
       
       Of course, you know all about Truman, right? Being a concerned American of color, you must be aware of all the white people who tried to change things for the better?
       
       Well, that's OK. If Truman didn't meet your standards, then we can change the date to 150 years, instead of over 200.
       
       en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_lincoln
       
       I also note a similarity between these two presidents, who initiated great strides in civil rights in this country - neither of them started with any great wealth at all. Perhaps that's your problem with "rich white men?"
   11. 

       2/06/08

       Kowgirl

       Is it the color or the gender that makes you feel that way?
       As I remember, J.F. Kennedy and "Bill" Clinton were the only presidents who were leading us into a NO TAXATION Country. (Why do you think they were so eager to get them out of the White House) I pray that Hillary gets into the White House and picks up where these 2 men got either killed for or wrongly forced out of office. It's a shame when a person says they will not vote for someone because of race or gender. Just proves You don't have to be white to be a racist.
   12. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       I don't recall saying that I will not vote for a woman and I never said I would not vote for someone because they are white.
       
       I will vote for anyone that represents real change and not the same ole good ole boy network in Washington and I am not afraid for the sacrifice that might come along with real change.
       I do feel that Hillary stands for the good ole boy network.
   13. 

       4/26/08

       timethief

       @ghostfish
       Right on!
8. 

   1/26/08

   Wahhippie

   This is interesting. I think you should vote for the best man or WOMAN for the job!

   [reply]
9. 

   1/26/08

   robeyf

   Read and cast your vote delicately:)
   www.catswiththumbs.com/2008/01/on-campaign-trail-special-to-cats-with.html

   [reply]
   1. 

      1/26/08

      gmoney

      that is great
10. 

    1/26/08

    offendedblogger

    Hmmm...imagine if me, a white girl from the state of Idaho, started a thread titled "Don't vote for a black man"
    
    I'd almost love to see the reaction from that one...but I would never do such a thing, because I am not into race baiting.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       oh do it, chelle. Or I will start one that plays off Gaylon's argument to demand our next prezzy be a transsexual because gender identity minorities have Always been locked out of the Presidency.
    2. 

       1/26/08

       gmoney

       I would read the post with a open mind.
       
       look at these titles on blogcatalog discussions
       Jesus was a terrorist
       Are Christians morally superior to non-Christians?
       Is Sylvia Browne A Fraud?
       Dog Gave Birth to a Mutant Like Human: Very Weird
       How can anyone believe in the Bible?
       Blogger / BlogSpot sucks - Move while you still can
       Religion to keeps public under wraps?
    3. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       They would actually have to be an albino bisexual transexual orphan with one arm, half a leg, dyslexia, erectile dysfunction, low self esteem and be a mixture of at least three distinct ethnic groups who have been enslaved by the white man at some point for it to even BEGIN to be fair in my book!!
    4. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       G man, yes and then there is my infamous baking soda thread which is THE most controversial post ever in the history of the internet.
11. 

    1/26/08

    BlogEntrepreneur

    I'm probably voting for McCain.
    
    I don't like the white woman or the black guy.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       you and Gaylon are a Perfect Match. I really mean that.
    2. 

       1/26/08

       gmoney

       lol I love it.... thanks for your honesty..... the black guy... I love it
    3. 

       1/26/08

       gmoney

       libdrone.... it is Gylon.... but it does not matter really, you can refer to me as the black guy LOL
    4. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       oops, sorry for mis-spelling your name, Gylon.
       
       and BE-- you and Gylon Are a perfect matched set and I think it's Hilarious. could care less about putting a dent in either of you. I'm just laughing at you.
    5. 

       1/28/08

       AngieA

       Me either BlogEntrepreneur
12. 

    1/26/08

    BlogEntrepreneur

    libdrone....on your best day ever....you will have to work 4 times harder than that...to even begin to put a dent in me.
    
    If you're too thick to see sarcasm...then I can't help you.
    
    "I really mean that"
    
    Call a WAAAAAmbulance.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/26/08

       gmoney

       want some wine with that cheese......
    2. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       Weird!
       
       For a minute I had a flash back to my childhood just now...I was standing on the playground in 4th grade watching my classmates hurl insults.
       
       Of course, I was a tattle tale back then. Where is the ^$&! yard duty when you need her??
    3. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       roflmao. report the thread, Chelle, please Report the thread
    4. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       Oh this thread will die a slow painful death just like all the others...but we all know baking soda will live on, no matter who is president!!
13. 

    1/26/08

    gmoney

    lol libdrone... my saturday night is great now

    [reply]
14. 

    1/26/08

    crpitt

    For once I am happy to live in the UK

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       so where are your Maggie Thatcher and Tony Blair jokes?
    2. 

       1/26/08

       crpitt

       Shall i fetch them?
    3. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       oh please do. I intend to laugh at this thread all night so by all means add More jokes
    4. 

       1/26/08

       MadameX

       Alan...I think there's PLENTY of material here to last all night...
15. 

    1/26/08

    lamenews

    mccain

    [reply]
16. 

    1/26/08

    Kraziquban

    Sorry but I don't think Obama is so very different from a white woman...in fact he's probably more of a white woman than Hilary. She actually has a pair.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/26/08

       gmoney

       That is like saying that Bill Clinton was the first black president.... ummmm yeah ok......
    2. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       sounds like you are confusing Obama with Michael Jackson
    3. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       Bill Clinton isn't black??
       
       WTF?
       
       I really need a new TV!!
    4. 

       1/26/08

       ghostytwofish

       Hey, don't be dissing Michael Jackson. He lives the American dream.
       
       Where else could a poor black lad from Indiana grow up to become a rich white woman in Santa Barbara?
    5. 

       1/26/08

       ender

       well, since no other country has the state of indiana AND the city of santa barbara, i'm pretty sure there is nowhere else your scenario could occur.
    6. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       OK now you guys are just messing with me.
       
       Michael Jackson isn't a white guy from Philadelphia??
       
       I am so confused!!!!
    7. 

       1/26/08

       ghostytwofish

       OB:
       
       en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Jackson_(writer)
       
       Argh, this thing is a pain in the a$$
    8. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       LOL!! I love it. A Jewish Michael Jackson from Yorkshire who made his living writing about beer and whiskey.
       
       Brilliant!!
       
       Oh, and very white haha. I'd vote for him if he were running. And alive. And American.
       
       en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Jackson_(writer)
       
       "Other names: Beer Hunter
       Known for: Beer and whisky reviewing and journalism"
       
       I love him already ha
    9. 

       1/26/08

       ender

       Bill Clinton isn't black??
       
       WTF?
       
       I really need a new TV!!
       
       duh, he IS black. he hangs in harlem and plays sax.
    10. 

        1/26/08

        ghostytwofish

        OB, please give me a URL that lists the percentage codes? this ampersand crap is about to rid me of my hair.
    11. 

        1/26/08

        offendedblogger

        Ghosty: weird! Mine converted back to the 'other' MJ link!
        
        Hmmmm...all I can find is the ampersand type.
17. 

    1/26/08

    robeyf

    I'd like another manhattan, please . . . ah, perfect. Carry on . . .

    [reply]
18. 

    1/26/08

    tlperkins

    I watched "Sicko" and yes, I wish I lived in the U.K. The whole squabbling about health care here in America is a joke when its free in French Frie Land.
    
    I'm a Barrack supporter, but I was also sympathetic to what Hillary was doing up until this week. She didn't keep Bill Clinton on a short enough leash and that hurt her. It brought up everything that was wrong about his time in office. It reminded me of the shame she had to go through. It made her weak and un-presidential in my eyes. Is she the same person, no. Is she a viable candidate... no. She is what the Republicans want and if she goes head to head against McCain she WILL lose. How do I know this. I would vote for McCain if she got the nomination.
    
    If a candidate is so divisive as to disenfranchise members of her own party she will never be able to unite the country behind her for a win for the democratic party. Everyone knows this. That's why Obama always gets his fair share of the educated (graduated college) white vote. In SC he got 34% last time I checked. That's why Obama got 50% of the white youth vote(18-29). Everyone in America wants a shot. The white youth vote is the least tainted by institutionalized racism in this country. Obama only got 17% of white voters over 60. Obama is not only change, but he is a beacon of hope for all Americans. I'm sure many voters that casts their ballot for Hillary or Edwards did so with pause.
    
    Yes this isn't the U.K., so there is no reason to have that same family in office again. We do things differently this side of the pond. What Barrack lacks in experience he makes up for with open heart, mind and ears. If we as the American people present solutions he will support them.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/26/08

       gmoney

       thank you for the insight.... the great insight
    2. 

       1/27/08

       knumerick

       Amen to this response. I agree and...I agree. I have seen articles in newspapers and online about how Hillary could not beat the Republicans if she wins. Also, as often as she trashes the republican party for all of their mistakes (Some of them, she herself, voted for, Iraq?) I have a very, very hard time believing she could even come close to uniting this country. She is far too negative.
       
       I also think it is time for change. Having the same two families running the white house is questionable at best for so long. I do, however, agree in voting for who you believe is the best candidate. Your opinion is yours, but please, just do some research and don't vote blindly because you know the name or something.
       
       Lastly, I think using the title of this discussion was in poor taste. I understand your reasoning for it, but that's doesn't make it acceptable.
19. 

    1/26/08

    BlogEntrepreneur

    A vote for Obama might as well be a vote for the GOP. He won't be elected....Hillary might have an outside shot.
    
    It looks as though the Dems are going to blow another perfect setup. It's amazing how incompetent that party has become.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/26/08

       gmoney

       why would you not vote for Obama?
    2. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       I wish there were something in that second analysis I could argue with, but I can't. Spot on.
    3. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       Spot on, cheerio! G'day mate!
       
       Both parties are incredibly incompetent which is why I have decided to defect to Tahiti.
       
       Who's with me??
    4. 

       1/26/08

       ender

       baking soda told me to stay put.
    5. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       Haha well if that's the case...you better do what you are told!!
    6. 

       1/26/08

       ghostytwofish

       I'm with you! ... but, uh, you need to set me up with a friend. I don't want to be single in Tahiti!
    7. 

       1/26/08

       offendedblogger

       Shoot, ghosty five minutes after we land you'll have two half naked native girls hanging from each arm!
       
       (Yes, that makes FOUR half naked native girls!! )
       
       Of course they will probably spike your cocktail, drag you to their tiki hut and strip you of all your worldly possessions, but I will take some pics before they do it so you can remember the good times, k??
    8. 

       1/26/08

       ghostytwofish

       I'll just hand you my wallet before we disembark.
       
       Tahiti! WHOO-HOO!
       
       ... uh, wait, do I get the sex before I pass out? Or, as I suspect, not at all?
       
       Never mind. I can get robbed blind by women right here in America.
    9. 

       1/26/08

       MadameX

       I'd say just the opposite, BE--I think Obama might have a shot at winning the general, but Clinton does not.
    10. 

        1/27/08

        knumerick

        lol.. This must be a joke. Obama has a much greater chance of being victorious in November than Hillary does. I know a large number of Republicans that will vote for Obama over any of the republican party members. They will not, however, vote for Hillary.
        
        Don't forget Edwards either. He's actually a pretty good choice, though getting stomped...
20. 

    1/26/08

    EavesdropWriter

    Tlperkins' reply makes sense to me, but I think it's also idealistic in a sense. There's nothing wrong with that; America's optimism and idealism has been held in question for some time, obviously.
    
    What I overheard in a dressing room last week deeply affected me. The conversation left me wondering if race is truly inseparable from the presidential elections. Caution: the post is racially offensive.
    
    eavesdropwriter.blogspot.com/2008/01/fried-chicken-in-white-house.html

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/26/08

       libdrone

       I still can't decide what to reply to that post Vienne and I've re-read it several times now. But I just assumed you were in Orange County and didn't find the it shocking.
    2. 

       1/27/08

       tlperkins

       Yeah,
       
       It's those kind of people that NH is full of. I grew up and Philly and have been in Boston since finishing high school. In New England the racism is institutionalized and under the covers. No one speaks it in public, however there is something going on in America. The governor of Mass is a black man. In the time that he has been in office we have experienced the kind of positive "change" that is good for all people. What happened in Iowa was not idealistic -- real white folk went out and gave their vote to a black man because they believed. There is something going on in America and its bigger than Barack Obama. He's just the smartest guy in the room; he's tapping into it. He was the only candidate that focused in on the people's voice instead of saying me, me, me. Dennis K. was a great candidate, but he didn't give the people a voice. Every American sees them self in Barack Obama. In a time where they feel like the system has failed them, Barack Obama gives them Hope. The people don't want to be robbed of their dreams.
       
       On a practical note, if Obama does loose it will be because of low voter turnout on the 5th. Many people don't understand that the "only" thing that matters is registering on time and making it out to the polls. The fact that Obama is dependent on so many inexperienced voters could hurt him, like how it did in NH. The voting will be close and will depend on everyone casting their vote.
    3. 

       1/27/08

       bsd13

       tlperkins - What? Positive change from Deval Patrick? My friend I think your letting race cloud your judgment. He's just more of the status quo for Mass. More tax and spend and tax and tax and tax. Patrick just happens to be black, but he's certainly not honorable. Listen to WRKO (680AM) from 10am to 12pm weekdays and you'll hear a man named Reese Hopkins. Black talk show host with an awesome show. You'll like it.
       
       As far as Obama goes I'd vote for him before Clinton, but I would vote for several others before him.
21. 

    1/26/08

    BlogEntrepreneur

    Why would her being in Orange County matter as to whether it was shocking or not?

    [reply]
22. 

    1/27/08

    bsd13

    Right, so let's get Duncan Hunter or Ron Paul in there!

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/27/08

       tlperkins

       LOL,
       
       bsd13, I agree with you on Deval Patrick's spending spree, but it's what needs to happen. You have to spend money to make money. While the country is getting into a new recession, MA never exited the last one. Look at the population growth in MA and the changing demographics. Deval is trying to recharge MA with a bog influx in the right kind of spending to get more corporate tax dollars down the line. You'll notice that he has been in favor of chopping existing corporate tax loop holes.
       
       As far as being clouded, I would never vote for Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson to save my life. It has nothing to do with race for most people right now. It has to do with trust. The status quo is out!
       
       -Travell
23. 

    1/27/08

    gmoney

    Race/gender should not matter, but it does. Ignoring race/gender does not mean that it will go away

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/27/08

       clioandme

       But it won't go away if people don't make the effort.
    2. 

       1/27/08

       knumerick

       Constantly bringing it up doesn't help the cause of letting it go away though either.
24. 

    1/27/08

    Sylvia

    Us Canadians up here are wondering why in the world your elections take so long....
    
    Actually, in my opinion race is still such an issue because we keep talking about it....LET IT GO PEOPLE.
    
    Seriously, look at who is running today...an Italian, a black man and a woman!!
    
    It looks very likely that either the woman or the black man could very well be your next president....LET THE RACIST GARBAGE GO, racism is not the issue it wasin the past.....hello....anyone home down there.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/27/08

       MadameX

       Wilder, what a nice thought: "racism is not the issue it was in the past". I'm glad that's the case in your neck of the woods, and can't wait until we catch up.
25. 

    1/27/08

    clioandme

    I'm leaning towards Obama, but I have a hard time understanding the Hillary hate. Is it Hillary Clinton they hate, or something about themselves and the United States that they are projecting onto her?

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/27/08

       libdrone

       Mark, I hate Hillary because I believe she is More in the pockets of Wall Street than her fellow competitors and that she is More dishonest, More power-hungry and More willing to sell all of us down the river to pursue her personal ambitions. How, pray, are those sentiments a projection of something I dislike in myself?!?!?!?!?!??????
    2. 

       1/28/08

       Sylvia

       As an outsider looking in from up here in Canada, I think Obama would great for the USA and the rest of the world.
26. 

    1/27/08

    jackpayne

    In this current age of political correctness it's probably best to not run for high political office on a platform of reenactment of slavery, or abolishment of a woman's right to vote. But, past that, I'd say the candidate with the most realistic grasp of life as we know it--both economics and social--will be the one who gets my vote, no matter the color, gender, or whatever.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/27/08

       clioandme

       "a platform of reenactment of slavery" --- What???
27. 

    1/27/08

    Getty72

    Speaking from England, we had a female leader in Margaret Thatcher, and in her prime she was one of our most respected leaders. I really don't think the family ties have anything to do with it (or the colour or gender for that matter)! It is surely down to the policies and principles of the candidate standing for election.
    
    I'd rather have a woman leading our country that knows what she is talking about, than a guy who doesn't.
    
    Good luck in your elections!

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/27/08

       clioandme

       The difference, of course, is that in Britain the party chooses its leader, and people vote for a party. Here the individual candidates have to survive a general election. That makes it harder for women.
28. 

    1/27/08

    beinki

    Can you imagine what she would look like after 4 years in office. Men age tremendously so I'm sure she would look like she was rode hard and put away wet. But it won't matter, Rudy will win the White House. How do I Know? I have not been wrong yet and also Missouri has picked every winner but one going back to the cretaceous period.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/27/08

       suburbqueen

       Does it really matter what she would look like in four years? Who would care as long as she did a great job?
    2. 

       1/27/08

       clioandme

       Two things:
       
       (1) How on earth are your comments about Senator Clinton's looks relevant?
       
       (2) "How do I Know? I have not been wrong yet" --- And you have been predicting presidential elections for how long?
    3. 

       2/01/08

       dharmagypsy7

       I guess you are wrong! Guilliani is NOT going to be president
29. 

    1/27/08

    tlperkins

    Anderson Cooper from CNN fame said it best last night, "Are we making things worst by making such a big deal about race? Is it really an issue right now?"
    
    My answer: It's an issue for the generations going out to pasture. Problem is, they vote.
    
    Ultimately everyone needs to make their own decision and be comfortable with that. So saying things like , "Don't vote for the white woman!" does not help anyone. Follow Senator Obama's lead and keep things clean and talk about the issues. There is no need to get personal, the issues loom large.
    
    What struck me as unique about Obama's campaign from the start was the fact that he was selling America and not himself. His actions in organizing this campaign is proof positive that he is a more effective leader. I think that is why Ted Kennedy is giving him the nod. I mean the way you run your campaign and the results you achieve is all that it takes to show what kind of leader you are. He has never put his ideals on the back burner during this campaign. The republicans will loose because these are some of the largest turnouts for the Democrats in history. Barack's raw numbers beat the Republicans as well.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/28/08

       robeyf

       Good points . . . however - Obama, as far as I can tell, is the most "decent human being" in the race. That is not enough. In an ideal world a forthright character and good will would be the attributes most desirable for leadership. We do not live in an ideal world; it is populated by flawed human beings, with many of the most flawed and intelligent in positions of power around the globe. A leader in this day and age must have relationships with those in power, the upper hand in those relationships, and a certain degree of cunning and mendacity.
       
       Furthermore, the real nuts and bolts of government is controlled by bureaucrats with lifetime jobs or appointments - the relationships a future president has forged with the various executive branch departments and congressional committees will be much more of a factor in determining his/her ability to alter policy than a perception of "goodness" by the masses.
       
       If I needed heart bypass surgery (God forbid), I would choose the asshole who new what he was doing over the sweetheart without a clue to cut me open.
30. 

    1/27/08

    kdawg68

    I'm only supporting mixed Romanian/Korean candidates.

    [reply]
31. 

    1/27/08

    MiLan

    'gmoney' said: 'I am not going to release my choice.... but we need change. Change in politics, color, ethics and hope'
    
    Just to have change in politics and ethics, would you be compromising with your country??
    
    He talked about change, but never talked about where we need change. Where he wanna bring change? change in flooring of the Oval office?? We need a change in Economy. Experience teach you where you ought to bring change.
    
    A fresher come down for an interview for the post of Chairman. Because of his rhetoric speech (even in interview), Board of members ignores his lack of experience and hires him as a new Chairman. WHY???? Because board members thought IF he could not do anything for the company, we will certainly kick him out at ANY POINT OF TIME??
    
    Americans, will you be having similar option for your President withing 5 years?????
    

    [reply]
32. 

    1/28/08

    SteepingBeauty

    hi everybody!! I've read every comment, very interesting stuff. I will vote Democrat no matter what, I'm hoping for a Clinton/Obama outcome. That being said...
    
    I'm sure there are a lot of different faiths on this board but I'm wondering if all of you believe we were meant to be governed by man. I personally do not, is there one man made government that has been fair to everyone? fed all the people and educated them? Nothing much is going to change no matter who is elected, keep your hope in something bigger than the man made government.

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/28/08

       MadameX

       What do you see as a viable alternative?
    2. 

       1/29/08

       gmoney

       that is a great point
    3. 

       1/29/08

       SteepingBeauty

       hi Madame X,
       There is no option at this time... that's my point. I'm saying go ahead and vote.
33. 

    1/28/08

    robinj

    I have no knowledge of the american political scene but it seems awefully odd that people contribute so much power to one person the preseident I would be more concerned by who they had by their side whispering in their ear white black red or pink its usually not the one in front that has the power but the ones behind the one in front

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/28/08

       tlperkins

       The president paints with broad brushes in America. The lobbyists fill in the cracks.
34. 

    1/30/08

    Aallred

    I personally think Bill Clinton was the best president we have had in a long time. So, I think Hillary is an excellent candiadate and she has my vote all the way.
    
    Just because the Bush family is full of moronic idiots doesnt mean the Clinton family is.
    
    Afterall, he didn't inhale.
    
    
    hahaha

    [reply]
35. 

    1/30/08

    m38967

    Steeping Beauty touches on an epidemic that might take over the country when only the top 2 candidates are left. Many white folks will probably NOT vote at all, since now they will feel that "no good choices are left".
    
    Jeez the stupidity and nastiness will NEVER end.
    
    Steeping Beauty: You were just being honest, werent you. Better to be honest than to B.S. I respect that, even if it is very dumb.
    
    Also god forbid something really bad happens when Hillary or Obama are in office, as he/she will never be able to live it down.

    [reply]
36. 

    1/30/08

    br3adman

    Would u rather a black woman be prez?

    [reply]
    1. 

       1/30/08

       m38967

       im too afraid to touch that one, buddy. lol.
    2. 

       1/31/08

       gmoney

       actually that would be nice....... maybe a mixed black woman, one parent black and the other white.... and a hispanic husband and they adopt a asian kid.....
37. 

    2/01/08

    harleyblues

    Yo Gmoney~
    
    I think your fear is that a WOMEN just might turn this country around and think with her Heart, Soul & Brain, unlike most past Presidents.
    
    Hillary is strong, just like most strong, brillant women in this contry. Don't be hatin on women dude!
    ta
    hb~

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/01/08

       gmoney

       That is a not a fear, but when a woman is a good ole boy and plays in the same network as her husband..... then there is no change. I am tired of the same ole same ole in the whitehouse. I think that a woman in office my shake things up a bit, but to be very honest I feel that a black man in office will really shake things up.
       I feel that as a country we will be forced to truly face our racist views, racist laws, unequal hiring practices and more. When Martin Luther King Jr. marched we was marching for equality for ALL people..... for everyone. I feel that Obama can shake things up. That is what I want something new, something different, I am willing to take the chance.
       If it was a woman not named Clinton then I would respect her more. She has a name to run on and her husbands record.... she is nothing new..... she is just a woman that was in the WhiteHouse for 8 years.
38. 

    2/01/08

    riverstyxxx

    I'm very strongly against judging our next president on race or sex. Sorry, crosses the line with me. And I've been known to talk some stupid shit, but I don't go for bigotry or sexism on a serious level.

    [reply]
39. 

    2/01/08

    zawadi

    I thought that when I get older I also become wiser.
    Well that's what I thought.
    The whole "race" issue in 2008 in the USA just proves how far we have come.
    It will take a few more generations I guess.
    
    When people talk about moving to other countries because they do not like who the President is and remains here throughout the Bush Admn. I have to ask myself WTF?
    
    I would move out of the USA only to see where my Ancestors came from and live there only when the conditions there improved, never because of a crooked President. That is worldwide.. the crooked citizens vote them in, or is it the Illuminati?
    
    I don't care what color the next president is, because I do not believe that the next President will do what his/her heart tells him or her what to do. He/She will follow orders from his puppet master(s).
    
    I do not think deep down that most people in politics go into office trying to cause chaos, but I believe they just follow the "good ol' boy network" that has been around longer than any of us.
    
    I already know who I am voting for. I just don't think he will win, even though he has many good Ideas and has shown this in his entire political career.
    
    Damn this system and Damn the colors that divide people. I care about my culture not my skin color.... There is a big diffrence and most people in america are just to ignorant to know the diffrence.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/01/08

       clioandme

       Zawadi writes, "I don't care what color the next president is, because I do not believe that the next President will do what his/her heart tells him or her what to do. He/She will follow orders from his puppet master(s)."
       
       Special interests are surely powerful, but to speak of "puppet masters" is to overstate the case and also underestimate the real impact that a a president can have.
40. 

    2/01/08

    harleyblues

    Yo Money the only one speakin about Racism is you dude~ light blub?

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/01/08

       gmoney

       Again ignoring Racism will not make it go away..... There are very subtle things that happen and that are said..... I guess because I am "black" I am more sensitive to this subject of racism.
    2. 

       2/01/08

       clioandme

       @Gmoney: Using an inflammatory thread title such as yours doesn't help things. If someone used the same title, but substituted "white" for "black" and "woman" for "man", wouldn't you call that racism? So what am I supposed to make of your title? I know you're just trying to make a point, but it's distasteful at the very least.
41. 

    2/01/08

    Rozie818

    What we need is an American Indian to run for office.
    Not white man pretending to be black or a woman pretending to be a man.
    But I'll take either one to get away from the Bush Clan.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/01/08

       dharmagypsy7

       I agree!!! FREE LEONARD PELTIER and let him run for office
       
       
       I mean agree about the Native American running for office.
    2. 

       2/01/08

       ender

       i would vote for peltier.
       
       
       and dear baking soda above, below and all around ... this thread is STILL going??????
42. 

    2/01/08

    jojoblue

    I am not black or white. I have brown skin but I leave in US. Why can't we just unite, vote the right person that can protect us from terrorism. Remember the 9/11 folks. We do not want another innocent people die.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/05/08

       gmoney

       I am not basing my vote on fear
    2. 

       2/05/08

       kdawg68

       Well....you did say "change of color" in your OP, so how is voting along racial lines somehow better than taking national security into concern? (scratches head)
43. 

    2/05/08

    knightcrawler10467

    Vote for Ron Paul..
    this is why.
    www.vidcool.blogspot.com
    Brief Overview of Congressman Paul’s Record:
    
    He has never voted to raise taxes.
    He has never voted for an unbalanced budget.
    He has never voted for a federal restriction on gun ownership.
    He has never voted to raise congressional pay.
    He has never taken a government-paid junket.
    He has never voted to increase the power of the executive branch.
    
    He voted against the Patriot Act.
    He voted against regulating the Internet.
    He voted against the Iraq war.
    
    He does not participate in the lucrative congressional pension program.
    He returns a portion of his annual congressional office budget to the U.S. treasury every year.
    
    Congressman Paul introduces numerous pieces of substantive legislation each year, probably more than any single member of Congress.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/05/08

       gmoney

       There are things about Ron Paul that I like, but how do you explain his "racist" newsletters.....
       
       www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/01/10/paul.newsletters/
    2. 

       2/05/08

       ThriftShopRomantic

       Isn't this word-for-word the exact same content posted about Ron Paul which I saw on at least one other thread today?
       
       Wouldn't that then be considered... um... spam?
    3. 

       2/05/08

       gmoney

       was it a BC thread.... if so it was not me
44. 

    2/05/08

    kdawg68

    It wasn't you gmoney, and she's right it was posted in multiple places.

    [reply]
45. 

    2/05/08

    Gorric

    A vote for Hillary Clinton is a vote for keeping the status quo in the US in the same mess it is today, she’s a cooperate girl with lots of old money behind her, and she will do anything to win, she’s very dangerous.
    
    Its sad that American media is so screwed up. Hillary Clinton is facing some of the biggest corruption charges in American history in 2008, and your media has hardly made a peep about it. It just crazy, her court case starts very soon, yet here it is Super Tuesday and the American people have not been informed.
    
    If she wins, America is screwed.
    
    If you have some doubt about what I just said about Hillary Clinton just Google "Hillary! Uncensored: Banned By The Media".

    [reply]
46. 

    2/05/08

    careysaysums

    Shoot, sorry I missed this thread when I posted my own. You've started a great discussion. I feel there's a need for change, just as much as anyone else to the left. You may be interested in today's post on CareySaysUms: careysaysums.squarespace.com/journal/2008/2/6/black-future-can-make-black-h...

    [reply]
47. 

    2/05/08

    robeyf

    You are all hilarious - typing away "America is so screwed up" on a piece of hardware the price of which would feed a family for a year in half the countries of the world. It's only the luck of the draw that you are here instead of some hell-hole where the food is delivered in sacks via the US or UN and you can be legally set on fire for dressing incorrectly. "Screwed up" as compared to what? You whine about "old money" and "old guard" - where the F**k do you think the money you spend goes? STFU until you know what you're talking about.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/05/08

       careysaysums

       And who do you want to see in the White House? Seriously, I really want to know.
    2. 

       2/05/08

       robeyf

       I'm not impressed or that concerned with any of the candidates. The Presidential job description has shifted; Congress has a much greater effect on American domestic policy - the President is now more responsible for our relations with the rest of the world. To that end, here's my take:
       
       Hillary - a tough political nut & good negotiator, but I think she would negotiate more for her own gain than ours.
       
       Romney - probably the most competent as far as experience with the nuts and bolts of running a massive concern successfully. Unfortunately, whoever his campaign manager is has him off on a religious and values tangent instead of focusing on his real talent.
       
       McCain - honorable guy, loose cannon.
       
       Huckabee - I just don't know.
       
       Obama - nice man, seasoned foriegn diplomats will eat him alive. He may have domestic success if elected only because a white congress will not want to be percieved as racist by voting against his policies.
       
       Ron Paul - only in America.
48. 

    2/05/08

    harleyblues

    comment removed by the community.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/05/08

       gmoney

       you have to be kidding me that you actually posted this junk........ I am wondering if you know that this is a propaganda email that is full of lies or you are serious?
       
       I hope you are smart enough to have done your research.
    2. 

       2/05/08

       bnsullivan

       For crying out loud, that email has been circulating for months, and Snopes debunked it as Urban Legend:
       
       www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslim.asp
    3. 

       2/05/08

       careysaysums

       If we say "snopes" three more times, we get FREE ice cream. ...Go Obama!
    4. 

       2/05/08

       harleyblues

       G money
       I was sent this via email, by someone that was sluething dude not I~
       
       you posted an inflamatory thread and when I read this in email I thought of your thread here. yep
       hb~
       
       BN Sillivan- I never heard of it myself snopes whatever.
    5. 

       2/05/08

       gmoney

       The title was used to get attention, the post is not inflammatory unless feelings get involved........ or ignorance that is about 6 months old is reposted because of ignorance.
49. 

    2/05/08

    Theresa111

    After reading this I am throughly pissed off.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/05/08

       gmoney

       after reading what?
50. 

    2/05/08

    suedoenim

    I can totally see the logic in your argument.
    
    But I was busy twirling my hair so I forgot...

    [reply]
51. 

    2/05/08

    suedoenim

    I can totally see the logic in your argument.
    
    But I was busy twirling my hair so I forgot...

    [reply]
52. 

    2/05/08

    ayachin

    it shouldnt matter what families run in office...but how well they do. being white or a woman shouldnt have a thing to do with any of it. Heck being a clinton shouldnt matter either as long as she is a good and fair leader

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/05/08

       gmoney

       There are rules in place that only allow for a president to be in office for 2 terms..... 8 years.
       
       If anyone thinks that this is soley about Hillary Clinton then with all do respect those people are wrong. Bill Clinton will be a huge part of the Hillary Clinton presidency.
       
       I like the idea of change. A woman that is married to a ex pres and runs on how "good" things that were going on while her Husband was president does not get my vote and is not my idea of change.
       A woman that takes money from PAC or Lobbyist does not equal change to me.
       
       For me yes it helps that Barack Obama is black. Everything about that man equals change. His name, He is black, he has 2 daughter that are under 10 years old, he is sincere, he does not play the political game, he has HOPE and he inspires and not simply because he is black but because he understands middle America.
       
       People need to realize that if Hillary wins and is reelected the same to families would have been office as pres or VP for 38 years.... and she talks about change???????? come on.....
53. 

    2/05/08

    ayachin

    when it comes down to it though..anyone really has the ability to create change in the country. just because her husband will be in the background on things it doesnt mean she cant create better things for america in the future...plus, i didnt think things were too shabby when bill was in office

    [reply]
54. 

    2/05/08

    clioandme

    I'm not voting for Clinton, but the title of this thread is downright racist.

    [reply]
55. 

    2/06/08

    gmoney

    it is not racist..... not at all. It may invoke a feeling that touchy, it says don't for a white woman.... that is it. It is a title plain and simple.
    Would it be sexist if it reads don't vote for a woman?
    Would it be racist if it stated vote for a black man?

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       I'm talking about the language of your thread's title. See what I wrote four days ago in response to a remark of yours about racism.
56. 

    2/06/08

    harleyblues

    your a racist dude just face it!~
    ta
    hb~
    
    If Barrak Osama were not an African-American do you think Oprah would be voting for him so passionately? What if he was hispanic or white?
    hb~

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       I was inspired
       read my next post.... Gmoney the resident racist
       www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/gmoney-the-resident-racist
57. 

    2/06/08

    gmoney

    I have been called a Racist because of my post title
    Don't vote for a white woman........
    www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/dont-vote-for-a-white-woman
    
    Oh yeah I am black....
    
    I used the title Don't vote for a white woman to get people to read the post. Yes I am guilty of using a title to get a response!!!! but in the first sentence of the post it clearly states "It is not that I don't feel that a white woman should be president, but if Hillary Clinton is elected..." and it goes into a explanation of my point.
    
    It appears that some people have taken offense to the post and I have been labeled as a "racist". To be honest I don't care if someone labels me as a "racist" but what does bother me is that BC members have not taken the time out to read the post, they simply pass judgment based on a title.
    
    In the post I even make fun of myself!
    
    A small group of people seem to be getting their feelings hurt because of post or post titles in the BC discussion groups that they don't agree with.
    
    I ask that people keep a open mind..... rather than getting defensive or taking offense!
    
    So since I am the resident Racist someone please tell me what makes me a racist?
    
    I will help you all out here are some definitions for the word racist.........
    
    Definition: racially discriminatory
    
    Meaning #1: a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others
    
    Meaning #2: based on racial intolerance

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       "I used the title Don't vote for a white woman to get people to read the post."
       
       And that isn't right. How would you feel if I did the same, but in a thread about Obama?
    2. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       I would read the post and discuss it. I would call names, or point fingers. This is a open discussion. If someone makes a valid point then it is all good. I might disagree with the title, but I am not going to toss the baby out with the bath water.
58. 

    2/06/08

    gmoney

    I found a interesting post.... take a look
    
    I always try to distinguish between individual racism and institutional racism.
    
    Anyone can be an individual racist if they believe in the inherent inferiority/superiority of one race over another, or if they advocate basing the treatment of others on their race.
    
    Blacks can't be very racist at the institutional level, for to really be racist at that level, they would have to control a large enough chunk of this nation's institutions to act on whatever individual racist tendencies they might have.
    
    When many people claim "blacks can't be racist," they are presumably referring to institutional racism. But I claim that all racism is not institutional, and for that reason they can be racist. They may lack the ability to oppress whites based on that racism, but in a few people it is there, and those people wouldn't hesitate to do so if given the opportunity.
    -- Tim Irvin 4/95 g post
    
    The post was found here...... www.mdcbowen.org/p2/sf/faq024.htm

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       Your apparent concern with racism rings hollow for me in light of the title to this thread. I explain below.
59. 

    2/06/08

    davet

    as i noted on my blog newsblip.blogspot.com/
    earlier tonight, i wonder if mc cain has fred thompson on speed dial? assuming mc cain is the republican nominee, he'll need someone to satisfy the far right loons (the left has them too). thompson does that and is qualified to be VP. one drawback for some is the age of the two - 71/65. or does mc cain go for huckabee, who is younger and well spoken? on the dem side, don't be shocked to see the clinton/obama or obama/clinton ticket, although i'd have a hard time seeing hillary swallow her pride and be the VP.

    [reply]
60. 

    2/06/08

    Gorric

    You know color of someone’s skin has never bothered me I really do not see race, to me it is all about how stupid or smart you are, and every race has stupid people. That is my prejudice.
    
    Therefore, when I hear certain people try to divide opinions by race, negatively. I cannot help think how stupid those people are, and I hate stupidity.
    
    Anyone who votes for Clinton because of race is just stupid.

    [reply]
61. 

    2/06/08

    gmoney

    my title was based on RACE, my opposition of Hillary Clinton is based on a possible run of 38 years with one of two families holding either the VP or Presidential post..... I don;t care that she is a white woman, it is more the fact that she is a Clinton. Again I liked Bill, and Hillary would do if her last name was not Clinton

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       So why put race in the title? It's a cheap shock tactic. Let me ask a question again that you ignored or didn't notice earlier: If someone used the same title as yours, but substituted "white" for "black" and "woman" for "man", wouldn't you call that racism? I don't care what comes after the title in the main text of the thread, the title by itself contains a message that stands on its own when viewed in a list with other threads.
    2. 

       2/06/08

       kdawg68

       It's not just the title, in the explanation of the title you say it's time for a "change of color" - so yes, race does seem to be a major part of your evaluation. I noted above that you replied to jojoblue that you "won't vote based on fear", but how his voting on race A) not somehow motivated by "fear", and B) any better than having the concerns for national security she expressed that you marginalized by describing them as being based on fear?
    3. 

       2/06/08

       jafabrit

       Not liking her politically is one thing, marginalizing her and denying her a vote because of what her husband did is despicable. It is also offensive to assume she needed HIS name to do anything, including run for office. Voting for her because she is a woman is as bad as denying her a vote because her husband was in office.
       
       ps. I agree about the title. whether intended or not it makes a statement that suggests race is the issue for you.
    4. 

       2/06/08

       morgantj

       ditto jafabrit.
    5. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       One other thing about the title: Somewhere further up, you said you did it to get readers' attention. I would suggest that you don't need to do that.
    6. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       Stoneman,
       
       If you did the same thing I would not call it racism.
       1. I don't know what your race is.
       2. This is a open discussion and my intent was not to offend yet to get a rise.
       3. I take all discussions with a open mind and I practice my right to ignore a discussion or discussion title that I do not like. I believe that we are all adults and we make decisions on what will offend or not offend us.
       
       It is easy to toss the word racist out, but what is a racist? What makes my post title racist?
       Again I ask the question...... if I said don't vote for a woman would that be sexist? Would it still be racist if I was a white man posting the same title don't vote for a white woman?
    7. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       Is there enough space between "offending" and "getting a rise"? You did neither in my case, actually. I am just sick of this kind of language.
62. 

    2/06/08

    robeyf

    How many of you can tell me about Obama's voting record? Hillary's? What bills McCain, Romney, et. al. have authored and/or support? You're electing someone to WORK, to THINK, and to WRITE legislation that will effect how your children are educated, the taxes you pay, and how your money is spent. Have any of you read the Federal Register or Congressional Record? They are your documents that keep a record of what YOUR elected officials are accomplishing (or not).
    
    If you elect someone because you are enamored with the media coverage or like Chris Matthews, don't be surprised when the sh*t hits the fan down the road. Instead of believing the TV talking heads or blogging brain donors, do a little research before you vote - find out how YOUR candidates worked (or didn't) for you, what they voted for and against, and what they have written. If that's too much work for you and you'd rather just mouth off without having a clue, you shouldn't vote.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       Gorric

       "If you elect someone because you are enamored with the media coverage or like Chris Matthews, don't be surprised when the sh*t hits the fan down the road. Instead of believing the TV talking heads or blogging brain donors, do a little research before you vote - find out how YOUR candidates worked (or didn't) for you, what they voted for and against, and what they have written. If that's too much work for you and you'd rather just mouth off without having a clue, you shouldn't vote."
       
       
       Bingo! You nailed it! Unfortunately that is something most people do not do. The talking heads are too real for them.
    2. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       Outstanding point. I have spent more time this primary period reading, participating and doing research than I have ever done in my 35 years. I turn the TV off and start searching and reading, the comparing. I don't know it all but I know where to find it if and when I need to.
63. 

    2/06/08

    clioandme

    @ Robeyf:
    
    Candidates' voting records matter. So does their world view and their concrete stances on issues for the future. But the Clinton/Obama race isn't being driven by these things, because they are so close together on so many issues.
    
    On the Republican side, the differences are a little clearer to me, but this thread isn't dealing with that race.
    
    By the way, who here said anything about Chris Matthews or the media?

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       robeyf

       I have not seen voting records, the candidate's written work, or references to actual bills or legislation mentioned in this thread - upon what are these minor pundits basing their learned opinions?
       
       A lot of references to "we need a change." What needs changing? Do the writers know enough about the mechanics of their government to understand the processes that effect change? Have they scratched the surface of their favorite's record to determine if he/she has the ability/expertise to work within a pluralistic system and get results? Do they know what results were or were not realized and why? Passion is wonderful if ignited by information - passion based on nothing is self indulgence.
    2. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       It's up to you to do the research. There is a group at BC that has a thread of useful resources here: www.blogcatalog.com/group/skilled-political-debate/discuss/entry/political-...
    3. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       robeyf,
       
       Thank you for the great insight and questions that you are brining to this discussion.
       
       What needs changing........ where do I start?
       How many Americans even look to see what the record is of their favorite or any candidate.
       I don't feel that anyone that is running or has ever run for the post of president have any expertise in what they do. The ability.... I would say most have the ability.
       It is daunting that Obama talks about change, because most of America is scared of change and sacrifice. Are we willing to pay more for gas in the long run to get a more energy efficient plan in place? Are we willing to pay more for products because we are bringing jobs back to America?
       Are we willing to stop living in fear of 9/11?
       Are we willing to make friends with republicans and people we disagree with to come to a compromise? Are we willing to struggle to gain?
       I will answer yes to these questions. I am NOT selfish. I have been and I can be but when it comes to my 8 year old daughter..... well I want the best for her. I am willing to sacrifice for her.
       I want a better education for her, I want her to pay less taxes, I want her to breath clean air...... I want her to see that a WHITE woman or a BLACK man can possibly destroy the good ole boy network......
64. 

    2/06/08

    AngieA

    Good point.
    I do believe if you were a white man saying the same thing, then this discussion wouldn't of been that big of a deal. Might of had less posted comments about it, that's for sure.
    I personally didn't see the title as being racist but as a cleaver "attention grabber", which sure did work.
    On the other hand,.... If I was a white man that would of started a thread with a title like
    "DONT VOTE FOR THE BLACK MAN" ...,
    Then, I bet you would of been the 1st one to start something with me. lol

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       not at all...I have a open mind and don't blow things out of proportion.
    2. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       I think reliance on such shock tactics says something negative about your assessment of other people here.
65. 

    2/06/08

    IanThal

    I have a lot of problems with Hilary Clinton (though if she gets her party's nomination, I will vote for her just to keep the Republicans from doing any more damage), but I find the subject heading of this discussion to be offensive.
    
    gmoney-- unlike a lot of people who post provocative discussion topics, you actually had some good things to say. So did you have to use such an offensive title?
    
    Besides, why should it be that a white woman isn't good enough to be president, when all the major male candiates, Obama included, are sons of white women?

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       IanThal,
       
       What a great point, if not the best point I have seen so far. Unfortunately people seem to think that I don't like Hillary cause she is white. I am not a fan of Hillary, but as I said before my opposition to her is because her last name is Clinton and not because she is white.
       Vp - Bush 8 years
       Pres Bush 4 years
       Pres Clinton 8 years
       Pres Bush 2 8 years
       POSSIBLE Hillary 4 to 8 years....
       
       that is 2 generations of one of 2 families holding some sort of MAJOR political office....... that is to much for me.
       
       Again it is not that Hillary is white.......
       
       To the point about Obama's mother being white..... I understand that and actually I think that is a benefit to his campaign BUT...... if his mother is white and his father is African, actually Kenyan then why do we focus on the fact that Obama is "BLACK".... it is based on ignorance and the fact we (me included) feel better when we can put someone in a box. It makes us feel more secure.
    2. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       Exactly Ian. Gmoney always has something intelligent to say. The shock tactics are so unnecessary.
    3. 

       2/07/08

       IanThal

       I live in a multiethnic neighborhood in a multiethnic city in a multiethnic country. I'm perfectly comfortable with a multiethnic President if he or she is the best candidate. So just to make it clear: Barack Obama is black and white-- and he should not be forced into acknowledging only one aspect of his heritage.
       
       Still, gmoney, if you are opposed to Clinton because you feel that politically dynastic families are unhealthy for a democracy, you should have said that in your subject heading-- that's a legitimate concern. I think you were wrong to engage in either race-baiting or misogyny which is precisely what your subject heading was (even if that's not what you believe in your better heart.)
       
       I'm in Massachusetts, and I have to say that the Kennedy family, through their many decades of service have earned their dynastic status, despite my general misgivings about dynasties.
66. 

    2/06/08

    Gregorioart

    I've been sitting in front of my monitor looking at this discussion for a long time,I've been reading,and I now feel sick to my stomach.I wasn't going to say anything.But you know what,I have to.As a young person I lived in Africa on more than a few occations.I was never racist,the thought never even crossed my mind.Most of my friends and play mates were black.You guessed it I'm white.I went to european schools but couldnt wait to get home and hang out with my mates.I've been back here in the U.S. now for 15 years and what I see around me absolutely disgusts me to my core.Should I be draged in and brain washed too.They have won again.They have been successful inkeeping us separated, and away from the real issues that we should be talking about.I guess there's no hope as long as they keep us talking about black,white,woman,asian,indian,dog,cat,etc.,etc.,you get the picture.Please it's time for real people and real issues to come togeather and make a positive change.Let"s be the first generation to send a message to our leaders, that we will not be lied to or taken for granted, anymore.We are here,we stand togeather and just wont take anymore.Oh yea I'm white and I'm male.Just had to put that in so you know where this rant came from.I also find the title offensive.If it was another color it would be a racist remark and in the headlines.That is exactly what I'm talking about.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       I will pose the question again. No one has answered this question. What makes the title "RACIST" yes it might be offensive, but what makes it "RACIST".
       
       Think about this, what do words mean?
       Words like
       Good
       Goals
       Bad
       Successful
       I am looking for people at this point to look deeper into the meaning of a word. What is a "RACIST" post title or Post. I mean really.... please someone answer this question for me.
       
       And AGAIN one more time.... this post has gotten so much attention becuase of the Title...... rather than the issue at hand......
       
       This post is not about Hillary being WHITE..... it is about her being a CLINTON, yet no matter how many times I say it, people focus on the word "white" I guess because racist views and racism plays to the lowest common denominator it is hard to see anything else. So I guess it is more important that the word "white" was used..... and it is not so offensive that our political system is jacked up.
       
       Finally..... I titled the post "don't vote for a white woman" to raise a eyebrow........ not piss anyone off. That was not my intent. It is still funny to me that title has dominated this discussion.
       
       And AGAIN I WOULD NOT BE OFFENDED if the post read don't vote for a black man....... If it was a term that was offensive to black people then yes I would take issue. But we call people black and white all day long. We are so concerned in this country with race and color. I wish it was different.
    2. 

       2/06/08

       jafabrit

       Whether intended or not it makes a statement that suggests race is the issue. The implication is you wouldn't vote for her based on her colour and neither should others. I know you are perturbed that the title has dominated the discussion, but you wanted to raise an eyebrow using race as a lure, so what did you expect?
       
       As for your reasoning against voting for her because she a Clinton, I did address that. Marginalizing her and denying her a vote because of what her husband did is despicable. It is also offensive to assume she needed HIS name to do anything, including run for office. Voting for her because she is a woman is as bad as denying her a vote because her husband was in office.
    3. 

       2/06/08

       BlogCatalog

       Whether you are offended, or not, isn't proof that that the statement isn't racist. I know yours isn't because I know you personally. You were doing it to attract attention to this thread.
       
       However, if I didnt know you, I could easily conclude that you were making a racist statement.
    4. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       Which brings up another point. Once you say something in a public forum, you have to accept that you no longer have control over how people interpret your words.
    5. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       jafabrit,
       
       My father is VP of a major restaurant company, my mother has been by his side for 35 years, step by step, helping him make decisions and supporting his goals and dreams. Does that mean she is qualified to run a restaurant not at all..... Yes I am sure I just offended a bunch of women but I am sorry, being the wife of a president for 8 years, not being able to pass successful health care reform, and only being a Senator for 3 years longer than Obama does not equal more experience to me.
       Yes she has traveled to over 80 different countries is impressive, but I don't FEEL that she was sitting in the closed door meetings about policy.
       
       Now with all that said do I feel that her and Bill were more of a team than Bush 1 and 2 and The Wives..... well yeah I do, but I still don't feel that gaining experience by osmosis qualifies one to be a president......
       
       I hate this because again my point is not that I don't think a woman should be president.... I don't feel that her being white is a detriment, the point is that I don't feel there is any difference from the Bush family being in office for 12 years and the Clintons being in office for possible 12 to 16 years if Hilliary is elected.
       
       We need to be honest here, if she was not a Clinton then her run for president would be marginalized. She would not get the backing. Her last name is bigger than anything. The same can be said for Obama, if he was not black, then he would not be getting the traction he is now.
    6. 

       2/06/08

       jafabrit

       I didn't say I was offended? I am saying that denying a woman a job based on on the fact her husband was in office is as wrong as voting for her BECAUSE she is a woman. The claim she may NOT have had the backing without Clinton name is questionable. Long before she started dating Bill Clinton she had been involved with politics, and worked with Senator Walter Mondale on a Subcommittee on Migratory Labor. Her abilities as a politician are as valid as any other person running, and using the fact she was married to a man who was in office doesn't disqualify her long history of political involvement and abilities.
67. 

    2/06/08

    BlogCatalog

    Stoneman, good point.

    [reply]
68. 

    2/06/08

    gmoney

    I have taken responsibility multiple times in this forum for my statement.
    I saw a post and the title was
    The "F" bomb :o
    www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/the-f-bomb-o
    
    no big deal right?
    but offensive to some I am sure...... A few weeks ago a Golf analyst stated that the only way to beat Tiger Woods would be to take him in the ally and lynch him. I was not offended, was it in poor taste and a mistake sure, but should her statement be labeled as a racist statement. In my opinion I don't think so. The statement was bad, wrong and may have racial overtones, but that does not make her or her statement racist.
    
    I have yet to have my question answered...... what makes the title racist?
    
    I would think that someone can tell me what is racist about the statement?
    
    Here again is the definition of racist........
    1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
    2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       clioandme

       I haven't got to that one yet. Gotta catch a bus to the train station now.
       
       Edit: just looked at the "F-bomb" one. No comparison. It is not "just as bad" as yours.
    2. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       ok be careful....
    3. 

       2/06/08

       jafabrit

       " Discrimination or prejudice based on race."
       
       Whether YOU meant it or not is beside the point (I am not making a judgement about YOU), the title itself is making an issue of her gender/colour and implies one should NOT vote for her based on her race. Is that not discrimination based on race?????????
    4. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       jafabrit so what you are saying is that anything that can be construed as being racist makes it racist? If that is the case then people need to look at all the racist things that happen on a daily basis in America. To some affirmative action is racist, news that is slanted to make minorities look bad is racist.... (I have the numbers), stereotypes shown on TV of a minority group is racist, not holding the majority group in America to the same standards as the minority groups is racist?
       
       So tell me where does it start and stop. Saying that something is racist is a pretty big claim.
       
       I would take Bill Clinton remarks on Barack Obana winning South Carolina as being racist.... when asked for the significance of Obama winning South Carolina he stated, well Jesse Jackson won and then he gave the years.
       So just because he associates Obama and Jesse Jackson simply based on skin color..... does that make it racist?
       
       Racism does not have to be stated as black or white....... it can be underlying as well. If we took this discussion and made it a issue in the REAL WORLD then things would be better and people would be more enlightened and ignorance would be able to be dismissed as ignorance. But we live in a society that would rather sweep history, mistakes, and atrocities under the rug, as to say if we ignore stuff it will go away.
       
       I never said I was right..... but I did what I did, I just don't agree that it is racist
    5. 

       2/07/08

       jafabrit

       Boy, that is a big leap! You asked why the title may be viewed as racist and since it implies one SHOULD not VOTE for someone based on race it fits the definition you posted. You don't agree with it, so be it! Did you want to discuss why you don't like her politically?
       
       Political dynasties make people uncomfortable and I can understand why, but America has a long history of it. Dismissing a woman based on that seems to single her out and ignores the fact that it is an American Tradition.
       Political Dynasties: An American Tradition www.brookings.edu/opinions/2000/0227elections_hess.aspx
       
       You said you feel she lacks experience, but there is no evidence of that. "During 1974 she was a member of the impeachment inquiry staff in Washington, D.C., advising the House Committee on the Judiciary during the Watergate scandal.[53][54] Under the guidance of Chief Counsel John Doar and senior member Bernard Nussbaum,[33] Rodham helped research procedures of impeachment and the historical grounds and standards for impeachment.[54] The committee's work culminated in the resignation of President Richard Nixon in August 1974.[54]" wiki
    6. 

       2/07/08

       jafabrit
    7. 

       2/07/08

       gmoney

       jafabrit,
       
       Ok I have a open mind for a moment, please tell me why Hillary Clinton is qualified to be President of the US?
69. 

    2/06/08

    marenda

    having two families dominate the white house for the past 20 years is ridiculous...to sign on for more of the same is a bad idea. It has nothing to do with race or gender its about electing a person that has the American people's best interest at heart. To date I don't believe that Hillary is that person.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/06/08

       gmoney

       marenda,
       
       I happen to agree with you, but unfortunately your statement won't illicit any real responses, because you are not rubbing people the wrong way.
    2. 

       2/07/08

       robeyf

       Are you thinking at all? Are any of you, or do you just want to see yourself in print? Are any of you familiar with the Kennedy family - John, Edward, Ted? The Roosevelt family - Theodore and his first cousin Franklin? Is it not common knowledge that sons and daughters, husbands and wives QUITE OFTEN take up the same profession as their immediate relatives? And are GOOD AT IT?
       
       Think of the doctors you know and trust - any other doctors in that family?
       Imagine you are looking for a homebuilder - would you have more confidence in a company passed down from father/mother to son/daughter over 3 generations or a new guy you never heard of? Why? Because they have years of knowledge and experience in GETTING THE JOB DONE.
       
       Elections are not meant to be a dream carnival - you are hiring someone to DO A JOB - when I hire someone to do a job, I don't base my decision on the advertising or what they say - I LOOK AT THE RECORD OF WHAT THEY HAVE REALLY DONE.
    3. 

       2/07/08

       jafabrit

       Yep, robey, political dynasties are as American as Apple Pie, which is why I am surprised it is being used as an argument against voting for Hilary Clinton. I can appreciate why people are wary of it, but like you said it is their political record and how the candidate has handled themselves while in the public sphere that should be the determining factor.
       
       My question is what is the basis for not believing she is qualified, or does not have america's best interests at heart?
    4. 

       2/07/08

       gmoney

       Political Dynasties at president are not Apple Pie.... and if they are then what Obama is saying about "change" rings even more true at this moment in time. He has 2 daughters and a wife that could care less about politics. I don't think we have to worry about his wife using the Obama name (riding his coattails) to be president. No dynasty to worry about with Obama.... again true change starts with Obama.
70. 

    2/07/08

    Wahhippie

    this is true

    [reply]
71. 

    2/07/08

    tlperkins

    OK,
    
    Time to knock it out of the ball park. Check out my new blog post that sums this all up.
    
    travellperkins.com/2008/02/07/the-most-amazing-piece-of-internet-content-ev...

    [reply]
72. 

    2/07/08

    mohd222

    Racist lol

    [reply]
73. 

    2/07/08

    BambooBlitz

    gmoney...You may have garnered more of the responses you were looking for had you entitled this discussion--"Don't vote for a Clinton."

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/07/08

       gmoney

       I think that the post is great and has got some good participation.... If I had to do it all over again I think that I would keep the same title. But hindsight is 20/20
74. 

    2/07/08

    TexasInmate

    I agree simply based on the fact that Hillary Clinton promotes universal healthcare. Read my blog to understand why universal healthcare--while sounding good for all--will not benefit America as a society.
    
    www.prisonproxy.blogspot.com
    
    Wednesday, February 6, 2008
    Universal Healthcare
    
    Prison has the quintessential universal healthcare coverage. A three dollar deductible (to be paid as soon as possible for indigent offenders; which means, if they remain indigent it will never be paid) gets one anything from allergy medication to heart surgery.
    
    Perhaps I’m wading into sheer conjecture here, but I get the impression that when one knows one is covered, right or wrong, a major pillar for making healthy choices is removed. In this case, however, what’s good for the goose may not be good for the gander. One’s lifestyle is so different in here than it is out there, that we can’t assume the universal healthcare safety net will affect people’s decisions the same in both universes.
    
    Even if the data from here proved inapplicable, I still believe the very concept of universal healthcare insurance is flawed. If the insurance providers must now cover even those who can’t afford insurance, the overall price for insurance must rise. Worse yet, if they can’t afford insurance, then they probably can’t afford healthy foods or healthy habits. Whether their situations are their own faults or not, is open to debate. One thing is for certain, now that the rest of us will be legally bound to enroll in this inefficient insurance plan, their situations are most certainly our fault!
    
    Look, I’m all for Social Security (though it either needs to be fixed or we need to embrace immigrants with open arms and French—or freedom kisses, one of the two), as youth and age are parts of an expected lifespan. But with universal healthcare, if market dynamics aren’t allowed to discount for the increased risk of death associated with smokers, drinkers and obese for starters, and charge them more to cover that risk, then the charge is borne by all, correct?
    
    And if the healthy live longer, then they pay longer, and hence subsidize the sick’s healthcare. My qualm is not with just any sick, by the way, but with those who end up sick due to choices they make, for which the outcome is foreseeable, avoidable and probable. In these cases, it’s not just healthcare that’s being subsidized, but foolish choices as well.
    
    And whatever happened to freedom? I don’t want to participate, I’ll just pay cash. Oh, that’s against the law, is it? It’s like my government is a cancer growing on me! Hmm. I seem to have stumbled upon a paradox: will my universal healthcare coverage cover my having it removed?
    
    Universal healthcare is merely a consequence. The problem is poverty, and that should be addressed by philanthropists under their own free will. When I get out, and fulfill my destiny, I’m going to do major things in that area. And I’m not special. Others are doing, and will continue to do the same thing.

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/08/08

       gmoney

       So you really are locked up........ damn! Sounds like you can do some real good outside those walls.
75. 

    2/08/08

    tlperkins

    Check out Will.I.Am and John Legend on Larry King Live on CNN! Related to the "Yes We Can" video.

    [reply]
76. 

    2/08/08

    harleyblues

    I'm just doin a drive by to say hello to G-money
    ta
    hb~

    [reply]
    1. 

       2/09/08

       gmoney

       what is up harley!
77. 

    3/26/08

    tlperkins

    Just testing something. You can ignore this comment

    [reply]
78. 

    3/26/08

    lordsomber

    "Don't vote for a white woman..."
    
    Sorry, race nor gender are not criteria in my choice for president.

    [reply]
79. 

    3/26/08

    happyfoodgirl

    First you said, "But for real, the headline was to grab attention."
    
    Than you say:
    
    "And AGAIN one more time.... this post has gotten so much attention becuase of the Title...... rather than the issue at hand......"
    
    So which one is it? Do you have a question to ask or are you just blowing smoke?
    
    "what makes the title racist?"
    
    Well, why are you asking questions that you already know the answer to?
    
    I don't buy that you don't think the title is racist. If I said something like, Don't Vote for the Black Guy, I'm sure you're not going to be as calm as you are now.
    
    "But we live in a society that would rather sweep history, mistakes, and atrocities under the rug, as to say if we ignore stuff it will go away."
    
    Will, clearly it has not been swept under the rug because we are still here talking about it now, aren't we?
    
    It's very simple: I'm voting for the person that I believe will get the job done.

    [reply]
80. 

    3/26/08

    Hippychikky

    screw white people! They suck

    [reply]
81. 

    4/24/08

    velvethammer

    I am not going to release my choice.... but we need change. Change in politics, color, ethics and hope"
    
    Not going to release your choice? Oh...really....?
    
    [blink]

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/24/08

       clioandme

       Who exactly do you think you're talking too? The last posts were 28 days ago, so the bloggers in question might not even be around to respond.
       
       Edit: me thinks you just want to stir the pot a little.
82. 

    4/24/08

    urikalish

    "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."
    - MLK
    
    Goes for whites too, right?

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/24/08

       clioandme

       The original poster of this thread has already conceded the point, over a month ago. Look at the date on this thread.
    2. 

       4/24/08

       velvethammer

       One would hope Uri, one would hope.
83. 

    4/24/08

    velvethammer

    comment removed by the community.

    [reply]
84. 

    4/24/08

    RuinousRight

    The interesting and entertaining thing about these discussions is how the conversations can resurface months after being started. I think the first assumption is that it is recent and our response is usually based on the present environment. We may not even view the history of the thread before our desire to post a response.
    
    Just an observation someone has probably already made.

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/24/08

       RuinousRight

       Oooops... there it goes to the top again.
    2. 

       4/24/08

       velvethammer

       "I think the first assumption is that it is recent and our response is usually based on the present environment. We may not even view the history of the thread before our desire to post a response."
       
       Exactly. And thank you.
85. 

    4/24/08

    gmoney

    I am still around and I still stand by the title. It is not about her being white it is about her being a Clinton and representing the same ole' same ole' in Washington.
    The Clinton's will say almost anything, but what is crazy is that there form of bashing at times is very subtle.

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/26/08

       kickdrum

       Gmoney, so now your title is "Whiteys" fault? You posted it, we comment on it, you blame us?? You're a racist!
    2. 

       4/26/08

       gmoney

       come on man, so now I am a racist? Tell me what makes me a racist, read my post, read what I said..... please point out at what point was I a racist. I think that it is fair for you to assume that I might be a racist simply based on the title...... but read what I say, don't simply judge me as a racist because you don't like what I say. I am open to criticism.
86. 

    4/26/08

    M7levels

    Your "white" comment may have been for shock value, but what really holds true here is this country is one of the most hypocritical, racist countries I have ever seen and lived in. Not to say EVERYONE is that way but the way people tip toe around the discussion amazes me. We have racism in my country but it's not about color it's about classicism that is just as bad. Since I cannot vote I try to not state an opinion, but we all know opinions are like (bleep) everyone has one. lolol

    [reply]
87. 

    4/26/08

    maboulette

    Don't vote for a white women - so gender bias begins again!!

    [reply]
88. 

    4/26/08

    zawadi

    I don't like that title and I am Black
    Vote with a Brain this Election and also who you believe will be the best at the job as President in 2008.
    
    Should we vote for a Black Woman? I know if Condi Rice was running she would not be liked as much as Clinton lol. I don't think she would even get the Minority Votes lol. Smart as she may be.
    
    Let's just use brains this election and keep the dick taters out.

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/26/08

       M7levels

       lolol zawadi I like your attitude!!
    2. 

       4/26/08

       gmoney

       it is so funny that people still think this post has anything to do with voting for a white woman or even voting for a woman. It is about voting for a Clinton...... but I guess people can't see past a title. I know now why shock value works.
89. 

    4/26/08

    Theresa111

    They should have deleted this discussion months ago. It still pisses me off!

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/26/08

       gmoney

       why should this post be deleted? Guess if it offends someone they feel it should be taken away rather than ignoring and not even reading it.
    2. 

       4/26/08

       kickdrum

       Gmoney, so now your title is "Whiteys" fault? You posted it, we comment on it, you blame us?? You're a racist!
    3. 

       4/26/08

       morgantj

       it should not be deleted.
90. 

    4/26/08

    maboulette

    Ok - I swore I wasn't going to get into this but obviously everyone believe the news networks opinion and talking point on Hillary Clinton and also none of you know what you are talking about.
    
    1. She is the most intelligent of all the candidates
    2. Way smarter than her husband and he was fairly smart
    3. She has complete, details, specific plans on almost every issue and how to pay for it.
    4. She has empathy for our military and those who have fallen on rough times because of the Bush administration.
    5. She has been in public service since graduating from law school.
    6. She has always been for children and women's rights
    
    Now, Obama is a fine and decent man but you need to look into who some of his foreign policy advisors are. This is not a race issue with me for I very much like Senator Obama and his wife. I just think he is a little short on experience. And with all the money he is spending - my question is why can't he close the deal?
    
    Hillary has been KO'ed hundreds of time by the Republican attack machine and she just gets right up and continues on - Obama has problems with these negative attack but if he is the nominee of the Democratic party, he won't know what hit him. Fox News alone will destroy him and wait until the "swift boat" machine get going.
    
    Ok - I need to go now - I just got 3 articles published today!!! Pat myself on the back!!! Pat - pat - pat

    [reply]
91. 

    4/26/08

    neoauteur

    "I am not going to release my choice.... but we need change. Change in politics, color, ethics and hope"
    
    We all have a brain. This is an obvious endorsement of Obama. So to maintain the fairness doctrine, I will go ahead and state my unequivocal support for Hillary Clinton and pledge to switch party if she doesn't get the nomination.

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/26/08

       maboulette

       No, no I am a Hillary supporter but I will support Obama if he gets the nomination - he will need all our support. And we can't switch parties - Hillary won't switch parties - I for one do not want the Republicans in office for a long time. So I support the nominee not matter who is it. I will be a bit disappointed at first but hey, anything is better than want we have and it is my opinion that McCain is just more of the same.
92. 

    4/26/08

    kickdrum

    What ever happened to "best man for the job"?? Why vote for Obama just because he's a different color? . Gmoney called it "ignorance" if whites don't vote for Obama. Talk about "anti-white race-baiting". Not to mention flat out racism!!

    [reply]
93. 

    4/26/08

    gmoney

    kickdrum, never once in this post did I state that it is called "ignorance" if whites don't vote for Obama.
    
    please point out where I said this.

    [reply]
94. 

    4/26/08

    csiunatc

    Gmoney
    
    You don't want more of the "same" ie you are remarking on the 24 years..
    
    Wouldn't McCain mark the same end as Obama? being that he doesn't belong to those families?

    [reply]
95. 

    4/26/08

    gmoney

    csiunatc
    that is a good point and for a moment I agreed with you, then I remember DAMN I am a Democrat at times a moderate..... McCain represents the GOP (grand ole' party) recent comments and party affiliation shows to me that he is out of touch. I respect him as a military man and I am glad we have men like him to defend our country, but over all I don't agree with a large part of the Republican agenda. There are some things that I agree with, but not enough for me at this time in my life to vote Republican

    [reply]
96. 

    4/26/08

    velvethammer

    David Plouffe (Barack Obama's campaign manager) playing the race card against Republicans.
    The National Journal reported:
    
    Question: Well, one of the things to which some Democrats point -- the Clinton campaign has not said this publicly at least, but one certainly hears it in talking to supporters in more of a background way. Look at the racial polarization in the last several contests -- Pennsylvania, Ohio, Mississippi -- is that going to be a problem? Is race going to be a problem for Barack Obama in the general election?
    
    Plouffe: We really don't think so. I mean the vast, vast majority of voters who would not vote for Barack Obama in November based on race are probably firmly in John McCain's camp already.
    
    www.nationaljournal.com/njonline/no_20080425_7012.php
    
    Obama's politics not with standing. Heh.

    [reply]
97. 

    4/26/08

    gmoney

    velvethammer the race card was played in the first question of the interview and throughout the interview. Plouffe is answering a question not trying to play the race card. Text bites are no different than sound bites. Anything can be taken out of context to make a point.
    Play fair or don't play at all.

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/26/08

       velvethammer

       Maybe I used it for shock value. lol Just kidding.
       Seriously what of the fact that 92% of blacks choose Obama over Clinton, (in Pennsylvania it was 97%). Do Democrats realize they have a race problem?
    2. 

       4/26/08

       gmoney

       why is that a race problem? Sorry but I think a lot of black people are happy to have a candidate that is a person of color that is of good, character, educated, forward thinking and attempts to rise above the BS of politics. He is not Sharpton or Jackson.
       
       Oh yeah and only 25% of black voters voted.... that to be is a bigger problem.
    3. 

       4/26/08

       velvethammer

       I would vote for a black man or woman if I thought personally they were someone I would like to see as president.
       But I would never vote for a candidate on their color or plumbing alone.
98. 

    4/26/08

    momscrazylife

    Whitey here....

    [reply]
99. 

    4/26/08

    momscrazylife

    Damn....White Woman Here

    [reply]
    1. 

       4/26/08

       gmoney

       I like white women LOL
    2. 

       4/26/08

       velvethammer

       LOL! Present.
100. 

     4/26/08

     Static

     I'm all for voting for androgynous purple people and hermaphrodites.

     [reply]
     1. 

        4/26/08

        velvethammer

        Not me. I do not care for Clinton either.
        
        
101. 

     4/26/08

     offendedblogger

     Women have no place in politics, we should all just stay in the kitchen and bedroom.
     
     End of story.

     [reply]
     1. 

        4/26/08

        velvethammer

        On the other hand if one can not take the heat, one should get out of the kitchen. lol
        
        Some like it hot. Some like it not so hot.
     2. 

        4/26/08

        timethief

        @offendedblogger
        I hope you were duly impressed by my repetitive use of "offensive" above ... ha! ha! ha!
        P.S. Also note that I don't do the cooking.
     3. 

        4/26/08

        timethief

        oops! click the wrong one
102. 

     4/26/08

     zawadi

     This thread was meant for Shock and Awe, to get readers. Congrats \\ //

     [reply]
     1. 

        4/26/08

        offendedblogger

        Hey! I love the \\ // so I am stealing it.
     2. 

        4/26/08

        gmoney

        the title was meant for Shock and Awe...... the post was not
103. 

     4/27/08

     harvey96

     I'm an Asian. I'm still doubt that most American will vote solely base on the capability of the candidates, regardless of the race and gender. Otherwise, it would not have dragged for so long and yet no clear winner. It is really disastrous for the democrats.
     As a non American, I would like to see Senator Obama to win the whitehouse race. This will proof to the world that American walk the talk, accept a non black to head their country.This will set a good example for other countries to follow.

     [reply]
     1. 

        4/27/08

        maboulette

        What if you knew that one of Obama's foreign policy advisors, is one of the "One World Order" crowd? Would you still vote for him?
104. 

     4/27/08

     rcpopart

     At first glance, I thought this discussion was titled "Don't vote for a white MAN". I think that might have been an even more interesting topic. Maybe I'll start a discussion on that. Nevermind me. Go about your business.

     [reply]