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Ever met a person persistently begging?
Posted by crazyTsu • 13 days ago • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: Culture, guilt, humanity, right and wrong
As I was walking into an eatery a young girl stopped me holding a write-out in her hand. She told me she is a refugee in this country and she has no money no food and asked me to buy her something to eat
I have always been an asshole with beggers and perhaps unfortunately I didn't do anything to break the trend, and refused to help :-(
Did I do the right thing? What would you have done?
User Comments
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I wrote this poem a while back about a little girl in Okinawa, Japan that I used to just pass by each day and did nothing. She wasn't a beggar, but her conditions were comparable. I never forgot her.
Little market girl what’s your name?
I see you sitting there every day
with your mother selling herbs,
once planted on residents curbs
I see you, but I dare not stare
Other passerby’s pay you no glare
I wonder why you’re not in school
I feel the world has been too cruel
I contemplate what I should do
Anything, something, just for you
You look down to hollow ground
Nobody stops, you’re left unfound
Perhaps ignorant to any other way
You help your mother, and that’s ok
Working respectable, making ends meet
So young, innocent, yet incomplete
You’re mother uses your tender might
Promising you everything will be alright
But every time I see you sitting on the road
My heart wants to bear your burdens load
I’ve since moved away from your spot
But your stories struggle I’ve never forgot
I wonder if you made it safely through
’cause I too, walked on by – when I seen you.-
It's a good poem, but somehow I don't feel very poem'atic when seeing beggers. I have seen some REALLY pathetic beggers (for example with no arms or legs) and I have walked by along with the stream of masses ignoring them
But I have never seen such a begger in US, and I wonder what should have been done
Should I have just followed my heart and bought her a meal, or better stocked her kitchen with some groceries? -
@Morgan: Beautiful and sensitive poem! The thing is we can see in your poem that it is question of a human being with probably a sad story. It remind us that WE are also human beings.
I once returned 100 meters back to give something to a begger. At first, I saw him, but I didn't want to take the time so I passed on him. But for the 100 next feet I couldn't think of anything else. So for the peace of my mind I returned back. -
Thank you. She wasn't a beggar, she and her mother would sell what appeared to be herbs. I felt I wanted to help, but at the time I didn't know what I could do. I wondered why everyone walked on by and didn't even look at them. I didn't speak fluent Japanese, and it might be offensive to just offer them money when they obviously choose to try to work to make an income. I suppose I could have just bought some of those herbs. Well, anyways I didn't. But I never forgot her. So I thought the least I could do is share the story, and maybe that would make a difference in some people hearts that might find themselves in the same situation.
When I spoke to my in-laws about her, they knew who I was talking about and gave me what little bit of history they knew about her and her mother.
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I have very mixed emotions....I'd prefer to buy a bag of groceries or a meal at mcdonalds than give them money outright because the cynic in me doesn't believe the money would be well-spent.
however, I've also experienced this in Austria - every day, we'd pass by a group of "homeless" or at least very poor musicians, playing their music for money. every day, my sister would want to give them money and we'd tell her to plug up her bleeding heart. Finally, on our last day, we let her give them money. She comes back - with a CD in her hands. They are begging yet they've managed to produce a CD (awful CD by the way). Puh-lease. Thus, my cynicism was forever instilled on "beggars." Money, no. Food, yes.
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Ask them If they would like something to eat...if they say yes take them to get something to eat - if they say no, well then say all I will offer you is food (cloths are nice to if you are feeling really generous). When the person says no it usually means they would like to spend the money on something they do not wish to talk to you about.
If someone is thirsty - give them water
If someone is hungry - give them food -> you would want the same if you were in that situation.-
Hmm it's THEIR family of 6 I might be more worried about.. mine is yet small. I've been thinking, if she were having no one else then perhaps easier to help her. BUT if he has a family and her parents/husband/whomsoever is sending her on a begging errand, then perhaps I should pay no heed
Stopping and talking might have been a better idea? -
Well if every beggar you pass by has a family of 6, and you pass by 4 beggars, but don't have the capacity to feel 24 people plus your own family, yet you have the capacity to buy one beggar dinner, which beggar out of the four do you buy dinner for while the rest of their family and the families of the other three possibly starve? It seems it will take more then buying them a meal a time to truly "help" them. Buy a man a fish, you feed him for a day. Teach a man how to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime. - Lao Tzu.
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But for "teaching" it requires time, and, who am I to assume I now better? Easier to help once and buy them time to learn?
An incident in buddha's life
Buddha comes across a disciple trying to talk to a beggar about he teachings. The beggar was not in much mood to listen
Said buddha to his disciple: When a person has dire need of some food, you dont feed him with preachings. You must satisfy a human's basic needs first! -
Yes, it does require time. So are you really concerned with their well-being, or only concerned with satisfying your conscious at the moment? Because by tomorrow they will be hungry again, and who will feed them then? Does that not bother your conscious? Does that one meal you bought them satisfy your conscious's hunger and does it truly help them? The next day they are in the exact same predicament.
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I think the 2 actions are valuable. Ones need to be feed when hungry, but one needs to learn how to provides its own food in order to be selfsufficient and restore its dignity.
This is the biggest error ( I am not sure if it's an error or a political decision) I have seen from developped countries in Africa. They give the food time to time, without giving the people the tools to become selfsufficient. Which in a long terms means that the problem will not be resolved, and the dependance will not end. -
exactly, angelshairs. I do agree that buying them a single meal gets them by for the moment, but it certainly does not fix the problem. You feed them a meal and you prolong their struggle to the next meal, though if you teach them how to become self-sufficient, and give them the tools to do so, I feel that is truly caring about their well-being, and helping them. Yes, this takes more effort on our part, so you have to ask yourself, how much do your really care?
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Isn't it possible to give someone a meal AND work on the root causes of their poverty? Morgan, I saw that you're from Arlington Heights, and there are plenty of ways to help the poor in the Chicagoland area. If you found out what those options were, you could offer that info to the beggar, as well as some food.
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Absolutely both can be done, my point is though, it seems that some people are saying the reason they buy a person a meal is because they care about them. But I don't think this is true, I think they just buy them a meal because they want to ease their conscious, a wannabe altruistic act, telling themselves "I just helped a beggar, good for me" or what have you. But I think that if one TRULY cared about them, one would want to help fix the root causes, and give them the ability to be self-sufficient. If one really cared about them, could they go home after buying them only a single meal and act like they saved them. No, if one really cared they would be worried about their next meal and the next, and next... They would feel the need to fix the root cause.
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@morgan
You say that getting them 1 meal is a band aid solution and it will take us nowhere
There are things happening even if I get them 1 meal
- they are out of their predicament for at least a few hours, during which they can think about overcoming their problem
- The wheels do turn in helping him pass another day in lean times.
- I have the fulfillment of not having refused "food" for anyone. In my country and culture we have great respect for food
- Help someone in their struggle, and they will have good feelings in his heart for others down the line
- If she was truly from another country, then she is going to apply her feelings about any one, to all of the country. Be good, and she will think it is a country of good people. And in future the good in her heart would translate into a hard working and honest family when they finally settle down
Of course, the question is, will the beggar use the opportunity. It is entirely upto him. If he chooses to beg and eat all his life, it is also upto him. But how many people are really like that? What's wrong in giving with a good faith that eventually he will find himself some job as the economy recovers -
Yes, it is a band-aid solution. It does it's job in stopping the immediate bleeding, makes the patient feel good for a bit, but it doesn't help with the underlying problem. Everyone wants to provide these band-aid solutions because it is a quick and easy way to bandage the donors immediate conscious of the situation, they feel good for a moment for helping a victim for a moment. But who cares enough to take the time to correct the underlying problem? Few.
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Sometimes there are people like this on trains. They walk up to you and hold a note saying they are blind/deaf and need money. The train authority here published an announcement that said they were professional beggars and not to give them any money.
If someone asked me for food I'd buy it, but I'm always hesitatant about handing over money (in this city). -
Yea...keep thinking deep thoughts,while y'all do that I'm gonna call my step-dad and see how many beggars did the mission feed today,and if they need any help next week. I have a couple days open.
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Yanno - I used to keep some McDonald's cards in my pocket with 5 - 10 bucks on them... Once I had about 4 of them.
We went downtown in a big city on one of our trips - and we saw so many people begging.
Some you could tell were professional beggars.
Some were hungry.
I just picked those that I thought looked like they could use it - and gave them whatever was left on those cards.
They couldn't cash it in for anything else - and they had to eat with it.
It was a way for me to give - without being taken. If ya know what I mean.-
That's a hard situation for me, honestly. If I take out my wallet and I know there's a couple of 20s there, wouldn't it be silly to ask the person to break a 20 so I can give them some money? Or I'll look at those 20s and feel sad that I can't give it all to him/her. Then there's times when I don't have any cash on me, or I'm late for an appointment, etc. So sometimes I'm telling someone, "sorry, can't help you today." On the other hand, I have given people my restaurant leftovers or a bag lunch I was going to eat. I haven't yet taken someone to a restaurant and paid for their food, mostly because I'm a little shy in person, but after reading some of the comments here, I am going to work on my courage.
Bottom line, what I do depends on the situation, but I do try to be prepared.
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if a person asks me for something to eat i will never refuse him, i may share my plate with him.
but i am very bad with beggars i often give them more than i should and ruin my own budget
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There are a LOT of beggars in downtown Chicago. Usually I plan ahead when I'm going to the Loop (central area in Chicago) and place the amount of money I intend to give into a front pocket. I also pray that the person who receives it will receive good from it.
You never truly know someone's situation. It could very well be that by having one more meal they're able to keep going for one more day, and something good may turn up for them after that.
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While everyone brings up some interesting points, my personal philosophy is that if I see someone in front of me that is hungry or homeless, I try to help with whatever I can, even if it is a few pennies, sandwich, whatever without being patronizing or judgemental. We are all in this together. Homelessness is not an intellectual issue. It's a human one.
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Yes, homelessness is a human issue that will never be solved if we continue to merely use a meal by meal basis to "help" as the donors are calling it. And it will continue to be an issue if people are thoughtless and anti-intellectual and are only appealing to satisfying their emotions and the beggars immediate needs.
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Helping 1 bit and giving them hope where there is none because everyone only cares enough to help 1 bit is only contributing to their suffering. Meanwhile with this false hope you give them, they wait for that someone that really cares enough to create a grandiose scheme to help them indefinitely. Well, their hopes will be sadly destroyed when they find that nobody cared enough to configure a real grandiose solution, and they are bound to suffering and surviving off of these 1 bit donations indefinitely.
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keep thinking that morgan. It isn't a meal to meal basis,its a person to person basis.
My pop,looking at him living in his mission,ya never woulda thought he used to make 6 figures a year,house wife,kids,boat,etc.... no he is sick,not just homeless. He is exactly where he belongs though,because he is HAPPY,SOBER,HEALTHY....money can't buy any of those...
Intelect can't solve sickness -
I personaly did both, and it is energy consuming.
I do really believe in the importance of feeded in the moment the one who is hungry, and give a one night bed to the one who is homeless.
But I also agree with Morgan, as from my experience, the number of those hungry and homeless people grow and grow everyday, so we as human beings have to find a solution to the problem. And here, if the heart generates the action, the brain have to find the real solution. It is not only about feeding and giving a one night bed for people, it is about helping humans to find back their dignity. -
crazyTsu, what I realize is that there are a bunch of people trying to make themselves feel better by feeding their ego that they have done a good deed and helped by feeding a beggar a single meal for a day while not caring a diddly about how that beggar will continue to survive after that single meal.
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crazyTsu, the responses to your question range from somebody simply walking by, and somebody stopping and buying them a meal. The walk-on by-ers justification for just walking by range from some admitting to just being an asshole to myself saying I feel I want to provide a better solution for them than just a temporary meal. The ones that stop and buy them a meal have justified their actions saying that it would be heartless not to, and that it is a human condition that needs to be addressed spot on with providing and instant sandwich for them.
I am not lecturing, I am merely pointing out that if one does truly care about these people, and they want to help them indefinitely, it is going to take more than giving them a single meal. I think we all do care about our fellow humans, Those that walk by, and those that give them a meal. I only want to find a better solution then a temporary band aid that falls off when wet for a problem bigger than just a minor scratch. -
Morgan, there are some people who give a man a fish, there are others that teach a man to fish, and they may or may not be the same people. Both kinds of help are desperately needed. And it doesn't make sense to assume that people are doing it to make themselves feel good. Plenty of people are helping the poor to make the POOR feel good.
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@m
If I were to buy a meal, and just supposing what you say is true, that MY ego is satisfied and I am a glad-ass, what is YOUR problem with it, as long as someone's immediate hunger is satisfied?
And yes, assuming people do it for their own kicks could also be assuming too much, though I share the same camp of skepticism as yours
Ok let me pull it to an extreme end. You see a drunk man on the railway track and you know a train will be approaching in 5 minutes. Do you debate whether you are saving him for becoming a hero yourself, or are you thinking, I got to save his poor ass or he will be crushed -
I never said I had a problem with somebody buying them a meal, I merely questioned its effectiveness in truly helping them. I don't care what peoples motives are for doing so, I simply observed that some people justified their motives as being heartfelt and caring for helping them, and to me it would only follow that with such genuine heartfelt motives that these people would want to help the beggar become self-sufficient. Because with these motives, they would still worry about them with just a single meal. And while efforts to help them with self-sufficiency would take more time, with such genuine heartfelt motives it would be a relatively easy sacrifice. Which is why I said at one point, that the level of help one provides to them comes down to how much one really cares. I was not passing judgment, I was simply stating the different scenarios.
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Concerted efforts are usually best. If it strikes you to help out such people, find some organization that is doing such and volunteer with them a little.
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There are a lot of organizations that help with a specific underlying cause of poverty.
If the problem is lack of job skills, there are groups that teach interviewing skills, help people update work skills, and provide the poor with proper work clothing. A local college is a great place to start to find these kinds of charities.
If the problem is an addiction, there are a variety of treatment and coaching charities. You can find these in the phone book, or at county health clinics.
If the problem is lack of a permanent address or proper paperwork, many VA hospitals have staff and volunteers to help sort that out. A homeless organization where I volunteer sets up mailboxes so that the homeless can put down an address on an application and receive official mail. Our county clerk's office also works with volunteers who help them get official documentation, like a social security card, birth certificate, or a work visa.
If the problem is an abusive relationship, especially if there are children, there are womens' shelters to help them; some of the shelters I have worked at share the childcare load so that all the mothers can work while their children are cared for. Womens' shelters can be hard to find because they need to protect the women from stalkers. Check with the health department or licensed therapists if you want to help there.
If the problem is a mental or physical health issue, it's a much more difficult issue to resolve. Some people have multiple health problems that make them virtually unemployable. Some people with mental health problems can be treated with medication but they often forget to take it or lose it. Veterans are supposed to receive extra help, but in practice I've seen the help as sometimes inadequate. There are county health clinics to treat patients on a sliding scale, and some doctors and therapists treat people on a volunteer basis. The United Way organization puts out a great pamphlet in the Chicago area, listing all the local numbers for all types of social problems. This can be very helpful if you're looking for a place to volunteeer. I don't know if the United Way does this across the country, though.
Finally, I know there are ways to change the system of poverty, but I don't have any information in that area. There are groups that work to eliminate poverty through political action, but I haven't worked with any of those. Does anyone have any ideas on that?
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You know what... I ain't dun yet. Go ahead morgan and keep lumping everyone together in stats. The problem with that is you may never know who you are passing by. It coulda been your next socrates or einstien... it is a personal thing. That "beggar" bleeds the exact same color as you and had your hand been dealt a little different YOU coulda been the one askin for spare change.
Life isn't about stats its about people -
People by me don't cry a story they just come up and ask you for a cigarette or money. There are a lot of people with no money in this town but the state gives them food stamps, cash and rent assistance and more. Usually people here looking for money are looking to buy crack. Now Newark you get the "I haven't eaten in 3 days" speech-and it's funny that they all use the 3 day speech. No they too are looking for drug money. Atlantic City I have seen people who really just wanted the food. I have seen them take food from the garbage, try to sneak into casino hotels to raid people's left over room service and more.
I can buy somebody something to eat (occasionally it will happen) but will never give anybody on the street money.
Now my friends and family I will do anything for. -
Ya know,I have done and said the same thing. This past year with my step-dad,I have given him money knowing exactly what he was doing with it. I gave it to him to end his suffering if even for a minute. I could not make him better,no matter how much I tried. It was either let him get his fix,deny him and watch him try and end his suffering on his own,or just turn my back.
Well even though I do feel bad for doing what I did...GOD did answer my prayers and he finally went to this mission that is helping him,and in turn he is helping others...
Sometimes even if you know what you're doing isn't exactly right GOD has a way of making it right. -
Me to! Just a few short weeks ago I was sayin,don't give em spare change...that isn't what they need...well who are we to say what someone needs. We aren't,until you can walk a mile in that person's shoes,you are NO ONE to tell him what they NEED,but you can always say here's a few...point them in the right direction,give em a hug,and say GOD will ALWAYS be waiting,u aren't alone.
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On one hand you say, "who are we to say what someone needs." yet on the other hand you tell them they need a few and they need to be pointed in the right direction, that they need a hug, and that GOD is waiting for them. What exactly is he waiting for anyways, for them to die? When exactly does he plan on buying them a meal? Is this the very same god that is allowing them to be in that situation. Oh yea, it is, but he works in mysterious ways.
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@morgantj
While I agree that better progams should be set up so that people can recover from homelessness with dignity towards a better future...There is no way that I place my ego or some sort of "feel good" factor when I give food, money, whatever to someone in need. I do it because there is a human being in front of me asking for help. Period. Unfortunately, when someone is starving, sick or in emotional pain, they don't have the ability to "put it on hold" until we've all debated what the solution should be. If you ended up on the street, would you want people to walk past you? I'll leave you with this quote from George Washington Carver:
How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young, compassionate with the aged, sympathetic with the striving and tolerant of the weak and strong. Because someday in your life you will have been all of these.
....peace-
If I ended up on the street I would hope there would be somebody out there like me that thought about me for more than just the moment of walking by, for more than the just the moment of buying me a single meal, somebody that cared enough to not forget me after our momentary encounter, somebody that continued to think about me and cared enough to want to help me indefinitely and solve and help me with my struggle permanently. A permanent solution. Not only just a bunch of meal by meal donations, without hope, that would never end without somebody out there thinking about fixing the root problem.
Sure I would appreciate those single meals, but I would want hope that there was somebody out there more capable than I and the 1 time donors working on a better solution.
And as far as motivations are concerned, people help because they feel it is the right thing to do, and doing the right thing is considered honorable and good, and doing what is honorable and good makes them feel good. -
crazyTsu, So you think if a beggar asked you to spare $1.25 for them they would deny your offer of $50 instead? It is more than they asked for and therefore would interfere with their "affairs?" I think not. I think they know better than to ask for the world, and in turn get nothing, rather then ask for just a little and at least get something. But as you say, to each his own.
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@morgantj
You seem determined to win this debate... I stand by what I've said. I also know that to see homeless people on the streets in the western world is very telling as to how much is being done to rectify this situation. For whatever reason, these people faltered...and we have to stop looking the other way. My question to you is what have you done to help the situation, since you claim that "if you were homeless, you would hope there would be someone like you looking out for them." I personally don't have a solution, I'm just trying to help where I can...
You have a nice day...namaste
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wow - here I thought it was just Monday, not YOU ARE NOT DOING ENOUGH TO IMPROVE THE LIVES OF BEGGARS/HOMELESS/DISADVANTAGED PEOPLE WORLDWIDE.
Jesus - morganjt - you seem hell-bent on telling all of us that our opinions or efforts are wrong and insufficient for making an impact on the world issue of homelessness/poor people. So you'd prefer we just all did nothing, didn't give to foodbanks, hand out monetary or gift card donations, etc.... Or we should just sign over 50% of our income and perhaps that would satiate your appetite for saving everyone?-
Where did I say anyone was wrong? Everyone is becoming defensive because I suggest that these single meals at a time alone are not enough to fix the problem. And since this is what most people are doing, they are taking it personal. Is it wrong of me to suggest that more can and should be done to fix the underlying problem? If you say so, shame on me for defending my own opinion.
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i get to see many of them every day while passing by...but once i came across to this 8yr old boy at around 1.30Am near my home..he did not asked me for any money or food for himself, but asked me to help his mother who was pregnant, screaming lying around the street and needed treatment as soon as possible...then with the help of couple of my friends, i took her to a hospital and admitted her...she gave birth to girl that night itself...payed the bill of doc and we left...that night i wont forget for my whole lyf..
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Well...like I said before,it would be wonderful to find a "solution" for homelessness,but sometimes really most of the time it isn't homelessness. It is sickness,mental illness,abuse by a spouse,or abuse by a family member...that covers a lot of people in the spectrum. There will never be any one type of solution because ya can't just lump everyone into a statistic,because they aren't a word...they are PEOPLE.
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Prime example...KATRINA...the beauacracy of FEMA let a WHOLE bunch of citizens down. It was the people,the public who helped those people.
I got into my car and there was a reandevous place in jackson ms,I made the drive 8 times to bring people from NO,and biloxi back here. We let a family stay with us for a month. Our local churches came together and we helped people out. If those guys waited on a grand solution,they would still be waiting.Actually most of them are still waiting -
Funny thing, I just wrote a post about my experiences with homeless people last week. On two occasions when I gave money to two homeless people eating from the garbage can, I got yelled at by passerbys. One told me to give to Africa and another said I was f**ked up. What I've learned to do is to follow my heart rather than go against it and be tormented by guilt. I think a little compassion from each of us goes a long way. Sometimes we just don't know the tiniest thing we do can mean so much to someone else.
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"Tormented by guilt..." This is what I was talking about earlier. Many people give because it tends to their own conscious. Being tormented by guilt would surely cause you suffering, so to minimize your own suffering, you give. People act as though thier motivation is to help the beggar, as though it is completely without regard for themselves, but it is clear that often they really just want to minimize their own suffering of being "Tormented by guilt..."
Before people get all defensive about this again, I am not condeming this motivation, I am only pointing out it is clearly the case for many people. It is important to understand this.
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Well,you can't be eaten up by guilt at the same time,otherwise you just couldn't go on. Nothing YOU did made that person homeless or in the situation he/she is in. All you can do is go by the golden rule.
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