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IQ and multiple intelligences

Posted by yhc • 12/31/07 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Tags: intelligence, iq, multiple, theory

So I keep seeing these internet IQ tests online, and regardless of whether or not these internet tests are themselves bogus, it go me thinking about the very concept of IQ. Can you really put a measure on on "intelligence," and if so, what sort of criteria are we supposed to use?

Personally I'm of the same opinion as the late Stepehn Jay Gould (a frequent guest star on the Simpsons):
"the abstraction of intelligence as a single entity, its location within the brain, its quantification as one number for each individual, and the use of these numbers to rank people in a single series of worthiness, invariably to find that oppressed and disadvantaged groups—races, classes, or sexes—are innately inferior and deserve their status."

I'm not quite sure, however, if I would subscribe to the "Multiple Intelligences" theory: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_multiple_intelligences

What do you all think?

(And let's try not to let this devolve into, "Oh yeah, well my IQ is XX;" in fact it might just be better if nobody mentions their own IQ.)

User Comments

12/31/07

urikalish

I hope you meant to say your IQ is XXX and not XX...

[reply]
1. 12/31/07
  
  ThriftShopRomantic
  
  Ha... don't think we can be wow-ed by a double-digit IQ, hm, Uri?
  
  Hey, people sometimes get elected to office with that.
2. 12/31/07
  
  Xight
  
  Funny I was thinking the same.
3. 12/31/07
  
  crkian
  
  Lets hope XX didn't mean 20
12/31/07

urikalish

Are you Eighty-five from the movie Alien 3?

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12/31/07

yhc

Wow, didn't take long for this thread to turn into foolishness. If you read that sentence, you might notice it was a hypothetical example of what I didn't want somebody else saying. What I should have typed was simply X, I suppose.

I take it you all buy into the measurement of IQ lock stock and barrel then? Mind saying why?

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12/31/07

Unfettered

I don't. I think the multiple intelligence theory (or maybe it could be called a hypothesis if it truly lacks empirical data) is very interesting. I know people who are truly gifted at math, but couldn't construct a decent sentence to save their lives, and the other way around, too.

I'm not sure I can totally buy the theory, though. It would need much more data.

I do find IQ testing to be inherently skewed and often pointless. That recent study (a year back or so) that "proved" women were just a little less intelligent than men is a good example. Even if it were true (which I don't believe it is... demonstrably), what value does that study offer other than divisiveness?

[reply]
1. 1/01/08
  
  Jurnei
  
  Someone good in math, but no common sense may do well with intelligence test based on acquired knowledge, but bomb on "fluid" reasoning tests.
12/31/07

ThriftShopRomantic

Deep breaths, Yhc, it's New Year's eve-- a little levity isn't a sign of disrespect for your topic.

Actually, I'd thought-- while the classifications of the Wikipedia article were rather easily applied to numerous "intelligences"-- the concept had merit.

No, I don't think IQ is a strict hard-and-fast measurement of intelligence as much as a guideline for intellectual expectations. And the various intelligence levels even associated with IQ have been calculated differently over the decades.

[reply]
1. 12/31/07
  
  yhc
  
  This is a discussion I've been wanting to have in a serious manner, and I didn't want it to die because of a joke.
  
  Ok, I'm breathing into a bag now...
2. 12/31/07
  
  urikalish
  
  Sorry dude
3. 12/31/07
  
  Xight
  
  My bad Yhc no harm intended, at least each comment gives your post a bump =)
4. 12/31/07
  
  yhc
  
  Hey, thanks guys! That was really nice, and I didn't mean to scold.
12/31/07

yhc

@ unfettered, thriftshop

Excellent points you both make. Just to play devil's advocate, aren't there certain things we think of when we talk about somebody as being "intelligent" that you can quantify? If somebody is especially good at math, we can in fact test for this, and taken further, maybe men are going to do better at these sorts of things than women?

I see a danger in the multiple intelligences theory in watering down the concept of intelligence.

[reply]
1. 12/31/07
  
  Unfettered
  
  ok. Fair enough. One can test for math ability. And one can test for language ability. When testing for math ability, one has to assume a certain level of math proficiency. That is, if you're testing someone in math, and there's a linear algebra problem in the test (just to use a far-fetched example), and that person hasn't been exposed to linear algebra, it doesn't actually test true ability, just exposure. Similarly, if one is testing for language ability, and uses a set of analogies with certain vocabulary, a wrong answer might indicate a lack of exposure to the vocabulary, not an inability to understand it in context.
  
  I think we've pretty well established there are various learning styles. It's been (going with your example) suggested that the primary reason women are "bad" at science and math has far less to do with their intelligence than it does with teaching methodology.
  
  If I were raised in a society that told me not to try in a field, because I'd naturally be inferior at it, I wonder what affect that would have on my attempts at learning it, and subsequently on being tested on it.
2. 1/01/08
  
  ThriftShopRomantic
  
  The multiple intelligence idea reminded me a bit of the very-unscientific Horoscope classification-- to draw a parallel. That while these categories do show common areas of creativity or strength people tend to have, it also is so general in some respects you can apply them to almost anyone.
  
  I appreciate that it recognizes that not everyone has the same talents and strengths, but agreed, it does manage to portray intelligence as more watered down. Much like the kindergarten class where everyone gets a gold star.
12/31/07

crkian

Didn't mean to downgrade the post.

[reply]
1/01/08

dotartdude

Having gone through the education courses and constant teacher workshops, I can tell you that teachers are asked to address that entire list of multiple intelligences when they construct a lesson.

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1/01/08

abhatnagar19

Iq tests...i took one test at college enterance level..and i scored 149. Dont know if that is good or bad though..but i was told its excellent..

[reply]
1. 1/01/08
  
  Jurnei
  
  I got a 185, graduated Summa and post graduate With Honor :-)
1/01/08

Jurnei

Interesting discussion. My main occupation, the one I got my degrees in is school psychology. Testing for intelligence strengths and weaknesses is what I do frequently. There are many theories of intelligence:
Horne-Cattell = crystallized and fluid reasoning
Wechsler = not really a theory, more of a predictor of college success based on general knowledge (learned) and verbal reasoning skills.
Guilford = many abilities, hundreds
Emotional intelligence.

It's really a dumb concept when used by the average Joe, it means nothing. Folks just like to compare their numbers, which mostly is comparing apples to oranges.

-Each test of intelligence is culture based and must be used for something specific - a referral reason. If someone has suffered a traumatic injury to the brain, an intelligence test that has a battery of subtests can help to narrow down what functions were lost in the brain.
Some cultures do better with nonverbal tests, other with rich language use and education do better with verbally-loaded tests.

-Intelligence tests can also be used to identify learning disabilities when a child struggles in school. With a battery profile, the examiner can determine the child's learning style and recommend strategies to best accommodate their learning style and needs.

The use of the term "IQ" in and of itself is useless, and depending on the test, may vary widely. Don't waste your time with online tests unless you are bored and needing entertainment.

[reply]
1/01/08

Puffmatty

i doNt spel guud

[reply]
1. 1/01/08
  
  Jurnei
  
  Baad visul m'mory skils.
1/01/08

blogtommy

Having spent a few years reading various psychologicals I can say the IQ thing is normally, at best a crapshoot. Having had to undergo such a test once too, I can certainly give some hints on how to improve yours if that's in question....LOL...Hell in my "forced" test I came out with a higher IQ than the doctor performing said exam....but that was little consolation cuz in all fairness...He was the missing link and I will point other scientists to his address cuz we all need to prove our sh4#$%.

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1/01/08

ender

actually, if you read howard gardner's books on multiple intelligences, it makes a great deal of sense. however, his work has been largely misinterpreted by some educators and some popular media, which has caused something of a backlash against the theory. in addition to that, utilizing web-based tests to determine IQ or multiples intelligences or personality or whatever is largely to remove context from the tests and can only give a general idea instead of necessarily giving an accurate accounting. (having said that, i have done them from time to time for kicks or for a general idea )

the basis of the theory originally was simply to begin exploring the fact that the traditional IQ test was ignoring a lot of ways in which people "thought." i find it an interesting theory and an interesting way to further think about learning styles as well as a good way of recognizing strengths and weaknesses and ways to improve.

the theory is interesting ... the ways in which it is used, like most theories, can be useful or execrable.

[reply]
1/01/08

Essie

I thought this was such a cool topic and wrote a reply but it got so long I moved it to my blog drafts, for now. yhc, I wish I had the rest of that Gould quote.

Happy New Year, everyone!

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