Discussions
page BC forum threads when they exceed 75 posts
Posted by timethief • 2/04/09 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: blackberries, blog catalog, dial-up service, lengthy forum threads, page loading time
(1) Page loading time for forum threads with hundreds of replies is lengthy and many members are either on dial-up service or are using blackberries. Creating pages will reduce page loading time for these members.
(2) Those who have been posting comments and/or following the discussion found in lengthy forum threads most often want to "cut to the chase" and only read the most recent comments posted. Creating pages will enable them to do this more quickly than scrolling through lengthy forum threads.
Discussion questions:
(a) Do you support this idea?
(b) If so, why?
(c) If not, why not?
User Comments
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a. I do not support this idea
b. Not Applicable
c. There are a myriad of reasons why this is an idea that is not beneficial to the members of the BC Community as well as not beneficial to Blog Catalog. Based on previous comments of yours, one of the best ways to meet and greet members is to see them on the forums and learn about their personalty through their comments. If you "cut to the chase" - you minimize the social interaction between members. As well - It is wise to know what other people have said, before you make a comment that has either been said, discussed or tossed out of the conversation long ago and many pages back. I also believe that as the thread moves on there are often off shoots and other ideas that are born from the discussions, and this concept will limit those possibilities.
And - sometimes you just want to comment on older comments within the conversation - so - reading it all in context makes life so much better. I do understand that "pages" will make it easier. But it would take away so much from the actual purpose of the reason we have "comments" added to a thread that it well outweighs any benefit.
"Cutting to the chase" is possible often by clicking the avatar of the person on the discussion line - more times than not, that will get you quickly to the bottom of the thread. So that is one easy way to get there.
I vote for a "leave it alone" It works great...
just sayin'...-
Thanks for the reply.
(1) I want members to understand that if they wish to read every comment in any lenghty thread there is nothing that would prevent them from doing so if a page feature were added. If they have been keeping pace with the discussion this would then enable them to choose to use the page feature to "cut to the chase" and post at the end of the lenghty chain they could do that. In other words, the addition of this page feature would increase choice as opposed to limiting it.
(2) I believe this feature would be particularly handy on lenghty threads where one word answers are being requested because in those threads very little, if any, discussion is taking place.
(3) For those of us on broadband service there is no page loading time problem. However, statisticsstics for web usage show that the majority are on dial-up service. Although I am a bradband user, I would NOT choose to stand against any idea that may be helpful to those using blackberries or those on dial-up service.
(4) I am a member of other forums that do have this feature and members like it. In fact, the page feature was introduced as a response to member driven demand. -
OOPS! I forgot to say that this was not my original idea. I lost track of who suggested it so I could not credit that member in the OP above. However, I believe that the idea is worthy od discussing and that's why I posted it.
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there was a suggestion for 50, and i suugested that that was too short and said it should be 100 so you have taken the middle ground -
@siralmo
Thanks a lot for providing that information. As soon as I read it I remembered that the original suggestion was for 50 and yours was 100 so, yes you are correct I chose 75 because it was between the two. -
This is what i posted here in Aug'08:
//The latest post (in a thread) should appear at top, like the discussion forum. When we return next day, we need not scroll down to see the updates, especially for those with 100+ replies.
- No. of replies displayed (in a thread) can be restricted to 25 in a single page (e.g. if there are 112 replies, then the no. of pages for that topic will be 5 with the 1st page showing its LATEST 25 replies alone. (this will help those who delete the cache/cookies often. When we open the thread again, the page will load faster and we will also save some KB downloads).
- Alongwith 'reply', we can have 'quote' option too. This will help us to quote a post from earlier page and start a fresh discussion in the same thread. When posted, that reply along with the quoted msg will appear at top. Thus we will not miss that point. This will help those who return after a gap and quote/reply to an in between msg in a thread which has say 350+ replies. Many may miss a reply posted in between 350+ replies.// -
@donkeysoup
Wow! Great ideas. Thanks for sharing them again.
I'd love to have a quote option.
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I will support it if you aren't kicked back to the front page of the thread when replying to a comment.
I have used paged threads before, and many of them remove you from the conversation when replying (making any quoting difficult) and/or you are kicked back to the first page, or the pages become difficult to load.
But if the BC admin is awesome (and they are) I'm sure they can find a way around those annoyances. -
How about being able to collapse posts (and their nested comments). They can be automatically collapsed after a certain period of time (three months? six months?).-
Or just auto-collapse for replies to each comment - that can be expanded if you want to read the entire exchange?
Of course, that would require people to use the "reply" feature
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Goodness forbid they should learn how to use it!
Perhaps both can be done. Comments older than a certain period of time are grouped and collapsed together. When expanded, the nested comments are still collapsed. That way, you don't have to see the first 50 or 100 comments and just skip to the newer ones.
And, of course a collapse/expand all button somewhere. -
auto collapse is a great way to do that...
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@Friday13
Thanks for introducing the "auto-collapse" alternative. It was my next suggestion ... lol -
You're welcome
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I'm surprised this isn't already a feature.-
I remember NINE expressing that the technical aspect was more complicated than they could do at the moment.
Perhaps with the recent upgrades, it's possible now. -
Really? I would think that the discussion board code would be very optimized and amendable. TGK seems so professional about his coding.
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Oh I have no doubt he knows how - but..I think it was when NINE went on and did that podcast (or whatever it was called) I asked about it, and something about the server not being able to handle all of that code.
I could be wrong.
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I think the page idea is a great one. Another idea that I would like to see happen is to let users pick up in a discussion where they left off. Rather than starting at the top each time, it would be great if the system could remember that you last read post #24 and when you click on the thread again, it picks up on post #25.
This is how the discussion threads in my classroom work--and to be honest, if my class discussion forums were set up the way this forums is, it would really drive me nuts.
Another feature I would love to see happen (you asked for it!) is if you could ignore certain people altogether--so they simply 'disappear' from your view. If you decide to ignore someone, you don't see their replies to posts, new threads they create, etc. This IS extreme--but with all the problems there have been on here in the last couple of weeks (or longer--I've been gone a lot in the last few months), it might make things better for everyone.
My .o2!
Melinda-
@mtyler77
I posted your "ignore button" idea which I originally heard proposed by legabamel and Anok into another thread here.
www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/institute-an-ignore-feature-for-forum-thr... -
Daniel the Good Knife already kinda killed this...
www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/institute-an-ignore-feature-for-forum-thr...
Or at least moved it to the "bottom of the list" -
That's fine--the site is fine the way it is for blogging purposes. Personally, I like a truly threaded discussion, so you can easily see who is responding to who (and you don't have to do the @so and so). All the classes I teach have threaded discussions and I feel it is far more interactive than this one.
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I agree, it takes forever for me to load that "whats your mood" thread on my netbook. collapsing comments would be a lot better
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Yeah, that's why I stopped going to the one-word story and similar threads. The first 300 comments are old. Hide them!
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I agree, collapsing would be a good idea. -
personally i think paged threads are a drag, it takes a lot of the context away from the replies and makes it a pain to find a specific comment without having to page through each and every single thread.-
What if it were an optional feature?
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What about collapsibles?
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I never like the "page" theory - Many of the sites I go to use them and I never liked them... the "auto-collapse" - that could be useful - but imagine people actually using the "reply"...
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@thegoodknife: I agree. Although page threads are possibly more convenient, I think it might make people less likely to bother continue clicking through the pages and take away from further conversation within the community.
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Perhaps making the reply option bigger and more noticeable for the blind folk
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Poor TGK, as soon as he appears we're all like "POUNCE!!"
It's because we luvs ya though. -
Pouncing on the tiger? Irony.
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what are collapsibles?
I've been trying my best not to appear. you guys are too dramatic for me. -
Well, collapsibles are my own made up word for the comment and reply systems that allow users to collapse or expand comments and replies in a thread.
For example, if you had a main comment A and ten replies B-k - you could opt to collapse all ten replies, and only see the original comment, or you can expand them to read everything.
I've used a few different versions of this, and I personally prefer the ones that allows the user to see the original comment(s) (More than one comment if a general reply is made) with an indicator of how many replies it has received, but ultimately the replies are hidden.
you simply click on a marker on the comment line to expand the replies.
It makes threads sooo much shorter, and it allows you to skip over the silly things you want nothing to do with. -
Oh come on now ... there is next to ZERO discussion going on in single answer lengthy threads ... lol
Example: Why do you blog in one word.
www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/why-do-you-blog-one-word -
I agree. On forums in which the replies don't appear under the initial comments and there may be pages of unrelated comments in between, it's hard to follow, hard to keep in context, and usually not worth seeing through to the end. In forums that are set up that way, I usually just don't bother to open a thread if it has more than 25 replies or so because so much is lost in that format.
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What about having a true threaded discussion? The replies can be cumbersome when they get too long.
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No, keep it simple-
Did you get the book I sent you yet titled "The Truth About Pandas?"?
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Hey Tony - Did you ever decide if your "divine intervention" included the consumption of Eucalyptus leaves...
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Kelly:
I didn't get it. I looked on Amazon and it was a discontinued item.
Benny:
No, no, I can't do Eucalyptus leaves. We use Euc for cleaning and it reminds me of Koalas grunting. -
I must have bought the last copy. I will bring it with me "next time".
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bamboo shoots?
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Yes Benny, and Fruit Salad
My first encounter with the Reds was at a zoo I saw this little guy eating fruit salad, and I thought, that is the cutest animal (person) I have ever seen. Being a serious vegetarian, I was considering jumping the fence and sharing it
Kelly:
Maybe there'll be a Mini Series, the Truth about Pandas, I'm thinking Academy awards
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Sure do support it. Hard to navigate when there's over 500 replies and the page takes forever to load. Sometimes it even crashes firefox. -
I do like the "collapsible" idea, as long as the collapsed posts indicate whether any are new (so that you don't miss replies). I don't know how hard it is to implement, but I do think it would help to ease the scrolling problems on the hundreds-of-posts threads. -
I'm afraid of change
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Ekim - How the hell are you! Have not seen you in forever! My new Facebook friend
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Not to worry the threadjackers will be sure to socialize this topic right off the front page of the forum in no time.
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Hey - we are helping to get your thread to the front of BC - Didn't you want your stuff on the Home page - I think you should be thanking us... not the opposite...
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Thanks so much ... for taking the time out to help. You, Kelly and acousticguitarist did a great job up there. lol
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No, No, No - Thank you for bringing to our attention such a serious flaw in the BC Site. And now we are just working to make sure the Community is fully aware. We were thinking about these possible plans...
A "75 Post or Better" Tailgate party or even better yet...
The "Are there over 75 posts in your thread" Fan (or non fan)Club...
Brought to you by... the Clown, the Cupcake and now - The Panda... -
oh...I want in, I wanna be the sexbomb
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I didn't see sexbomb in the original comment - but - Hey - Your in!
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Does Dial-up still exist? ... I didn't know-
yeah, in crazy land where its cool to live like you're in the 90s
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About 10 percent of the U.S. Still does - I do not know about the rest of the World...
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(Hangs my head) I'm on dial up here at home. (Embarrassing, I know) But actually, the threads load pretty well for me. -
I couldn't go back to dial up. I used to have cable modem until I moved to an area with a crappy cable company Then I had DSL but I kinda got mad for several reasons and told them to shove it up you know where. Actually I probably told them that I would shove it to be exact. They aggrevated me too many times. Now I have wireless internet through Verizon Wireless and I am quite content. Not quite as quick as cable but Verizon Wireless so much easier to deal with then Verizon home service. Never had to tell VZW to shove it
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Two versions of the stimulus bill each contains billions of dollars to extend broadband Internet to rural areas. www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090204/BUSINESS/902040381
CBO: The full $6B earmarked for broadband might not be spent until 2016 www.rcrwireless.com/article/20090204/WIRELESS/902049981/1103/cbo-the-full-6...
Free, state-of-the-wireless-industry special report available for immediate download
www.rcrwireless.com/article/20090204/WIRELESS/902049981/1103/cbo-the-full-6...-
tt, whats my new job??? Im dying here
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@sensico
Check your shoutbox please.
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I'd go for that paging idea. I've quit a lot of threads because they were just not worth that much effort to keep up with them. -
My solution is this: paged comments.
Sorts everything right out.-
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@LynneaUrania and qelqoth
Thanks for wading in and stating your preferences.
Although I'm on broadband I have likewise stopped posting to the lengthy single word type threads like this example: Why do you blog in one word. www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/why-do-you-blog-one-word-
Groan! o yesssss....
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I agree with you but there is always strong resistance coming from longer term members, who don't want to see changes made. Given that this is supposed to be a member driven community, Admin seem to prefer to see members come to consensus as opposed to them making a call.
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Sadly, the majority have attention deficit disorder. Tis the way it is.
But yeah - the easiest solution would be an AJAX paged comments feature, similar to what is commonly used on bulletin boards and forums. That way, you wouldn't have aaaalllll that scrolling to do. Makes things nice and simple. -
@quelqoth
Yup, it sure would and it works like a hot damn in other forums I belong to but, eh, don't you know BC is special. Here the status quo is something that some members fiercely cling to.
I mean it's not as if introducing options would in any way compromise what's available now but hey, there are anti-choice members out there, for sure, for sure. Even if introducing a proposed option would not affect them personally, they don't want to see it made available to others. In the final analysis to agree to allowing options to be implemented, even if you won't use them, requires a cooperative and inclusive mindset. -
I dunno TT. They've got a paged feature for the discussions front page. Should be a simple enough case of taking that script and applying it to the individual discussions. Although I do agree with OPs being about to lock their own threads; that would be really useful.
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@quelqoth
Yeah, how could I not notice the Ajax on the front page, and yeah, I do know that what's being requested is not difficult. As for "OPs being about to lock their own threads; that would be really useful" thanks for weighing in.
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Back in November I started a thread where I read and commented on over 300 blogs, plus I replied back to the respondents. I enjoyed the thread, but it did become quite cumbersome. I would go in to read the respondent's request..waited for loading, went out to read the blog, after replying...waited again for loading before going on to the next respondent.
With over 635 replies, it would have be nice if either the thread had collapsed or had been paged. Not having to wait would have saved lots of time, not only for me, but also for those who participated.
www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/hit-me-with-your-best-shot-i-want-to-read...-
@MadMadMargo
I remember that thread. Perhaps if we members were allowed to lock (not delete) the threads we initially create when we feel the discussion has come to an end, or when we feel it has gone off track that would be supported, or perhaps not. As it stands now anyone can resurrect a thread at anytime.
I frequently notice that new members arrive and then strafe run the forum resurrecting many threads within just a few minutes. This drives all other threads down the column and some off the front page. Their motive seems to be link dropping, rather than renewing a discussion because the members I'm thinking of, do NOT enter anything of substance into the thread. We had an astonishing example of such behavior last night.
It seems to me that Admin has far better things to do than to delete all those link drops into resurrected threads. So perhaps allowing members to lock the threads that they initiate that would be helpful in more ways than one. -
Exactly. After a month or so, I finally stopped answering and felt badly for having to do so. In fact, almost daily, I have to wonder if it has been ressurected. Locking the thread would have been a welcomed option.
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cross reference to new thread found here www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/allow-op-of-forum-discussion-threads-to-c...
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Let me wait till your eyes focus - so you can stop editing...then we can go down this road...
4 edits - please do let me know when you are done...-
Hey, we are bonding and discussing and socializing here so ... bye, bye to you. But before you go please do us a favor and post the link to thegoodknife's no will you?
This is all I found from thegoodknife in this thread in this thread
www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/page-bc-forum-threads-when-they-exceed-75...
www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/page-bc-forum-threads-when-they-exceed-75...
Are those threads the ones you are referring to?
As my vision is so severely limited I have to make many edits but that's no real problem as we have already heard from you above. There is no urgency. You can take all the time you want while I eat dinner. Tra .. la -
You really do want to play this game don't you...
Whatever... -
Ooopps Sorry - Forgot - You weren't sitting between Daniel and Myself when we discussed it earlier this afternoon... Sorry we didn't include you - not...
and as well - We know you LOGO OUT... wander around... and then log back in...
That was the easiest part to figure out...
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Well, this is a nice idea. Some of the discussions get really long.-
@ishansharma001
I think so too but unless I'm reading it wrong, some seem to feel threatened by the idea of any changes being considered, let alone, implemented.
It's not as if introducing the options (pages and/or collapsability) suggested above would in any way compromise what's available now, and it would not affect those who do not choose to use it, but apparently some don't want to see it made available to others who do want options.
As I said above, in the final analysis, to agree to allowing options to be implemented, even if you know you won't use them, requires a cooperative and inclusive mindset. Thanks for wading in and posting your opinion.
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I think I like the collapsible idea rather then the pages, because I like reading through the discussions, and to answer and keep track of a conversation in a thread can be hard if broken in many different pages. Collapsing would keep it nice and tidy and easy access.
At least that is my humble opinion.
As for the discussion starter locking the thread that is a fine idea too, it gets tiresome hearing members complaining of... either old discussions that have being pulled up... or... not pulling up a old discussion that pertains to the subject someone wants to talk about, honestly you just can't win!
Discussions like MadMadMargo's would be great to stop and lock when you are finished. Those kind of threads can last forever and get longer and longer.
But a rule that... No Birthday threads can be locked... cuz they are fun seeing over and over again through out the years! -
That's right, you can't lock birthday threads!
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@arcticulates
Thanks for sharing your opinions. I also think the collapsible comments option is worth checking out.
I don't accept the argument that either paging threads or collasping comments will minimize the social interaction between members. This is a social forum and there is no such thing as "thread jacking" on it. It doesn't matter what the category is the thread is posted into, or what the OP states, the fact remains that members can post whatever they wish into a thread off-topic or not and some do so habitually. That's another reason why I believe being able to collapse comments or click a page button would be a boon.
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Collapsing sounds good to me... and paging if some of the bugs can be minimized. I don't personally have any load issues.-
I don't have loading time issues either. When it comes to threads I'm interested in I tend to keep pace with the comments being added. I view the ability to click and instantly be on the last page of the thread, as I can do on other forums, and as opposed to scrolling through comments I've already read to be a time saving convenience. Also when one encounters a patch of off-topic socializing in a thread I view the ability to collaspe those comments, and proceed onward to read the comments of those who are addressing the topical matter in the thread to be an attractive option.
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Some sort of paging would make sense, as load times can get crazy. It might also make referring back to earlier sections of the conversation easier, since we can then say, oh yes, that was on page 2 or whatever.
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As you know this is done on many forums Mark. I have never experienced a forum scenario before where some members are so resistant to introducing options that would help other members, and would not affect them that they would refuse to support the introduction of options. It seems we have a minority here who are anti-change and anti-choice. Hmmmmm ...
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In my group the limit is 50
I'd like that idea cos my phone hangs up when i try to get in a 200 plus stuff-
that sux
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Only 50 yikes! That's awful.
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(a) Do you support this idea?
Yes, and no
(b) If so, why?
People trying to use dial-up or blackberries to handle a data-rich resource may feel frustrated - a lot. This might help them. A little.
(c) If not, why not?
Everybody else, provided they have a browser with search functions, can jump to relevant parts of a gigathread rather quickly (I look for "(new" or "(ne" myself - without the quotes, of course). I'm with thegoodknife on this. Besides, it's one more thing in the system to go wrong.
As an option, I think it's a relatively harmless idea.
If everybody had to start jumping from fragment to fragment of a long discussion, for the sake of Blackberriers and people who still hear their modem sing, it would be more than a little frustrating the rest.
(Chopping information up into small pieces got discussed in a post I microreviewed in apatheticlemming.blogspot.com/2009/02/website-design-just-because-everybody... .)-
@Norski
Thanks for taking the time to comment. I appreciate what you have said.
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Yes, I'm a big fan of adding pages after X # of posts 50-75 is a good number. My blackberry will like it a lot. I use it 50% of the time I surf. And when it tries to load 1000 comments, it pretty much goes to ****
Sometimes people forget that there are multiple ways to access the internet now a days and it would be wise to make it work or atleast consider them.-
@roguedeals
I hear you.
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Absolutely!
Why?
Isn't it obvious? It saves time -
@buddhaofhollywood
Thank you for the succinct reply.
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I'm totally up for it.
I created a thread for this more than a month back and got negative comments.
www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/should-bc-have-pages-for-comments-on-a-to...-
Thanks for posting that link. I have re-considered since then and I'm now onside for the reasons I stated in the OP.
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I don't mind large threads as long as they are relevant. Sometimes I do wish that newer stuff was at the top vs the end; but then other times I do not.
I guess it just depends on the topic.-
@SAHMinIL
Thanks for sharing what you think. I appreciate it.
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One thing which I dont entirely like in this format is the reply feature.
When someone makes a reply to one of the comments.. it gets nested somewhere deep in the middle..
It is not very obvious what the latest comment was.. and I would have to scan the entire page of over 150 comments.
It should be something like Youtube.. where the recent comments are shown under the video but once you click to view all comments, you can see the normal threaded style.
A better solution would be to use a phpbb type forum-
@dsriharsha
It should be something like Youtube.. where the recent comments are shown under the video but once you click to view all comments, you can see the normal threaded style.
A better solution would be to use a phpbb type forum
Yes I know exactly what you mean as I am a member of other forums where we do have such a feature. I'm also familiar with phpbb type forums as well. Thanks for weighing in.
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I like the fact that this thread is over 75 posts and there are no pages to click through...
I can read point and counter point - and sometimes comment or not - but I get it all in context without getting lost on page three when the conversation takes a left turn, but returns to the "topic" late on page 4... -
Now, admins we really need solution! Look at this thread with 880+ replies: www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/alphabet-game-music-edition
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it's unnecessary. you can easily click on the "last comment" avatar to the right of the post-
How will it reduce page loading times for people with slow connection?
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