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Purpose of the Bible
Posted by oscargecko • 6/27/09 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: Bible, purpose
What do you think is the purpose of the Bible?
User Comments
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Well I said I wasn't gonna comment on religious threads anymore,but couldn't resist this one.
Purpose of the bible? A book from our creator to show us how to live,how jesus came to be,how the world came to be, how life came to be,how u should "try" to live your life,how our messiah lived a PERFECT sin free life and decided to take on the sin of man so we all could have a chance to meet our maker etc...........I could go on and on,but I won't knowing how some of u guys don't like to hear the christian girl ramble-
me too.. couldn't resist
//A book from our creator to show us how to live//
Lot was considered a just man.. go figure
//how jesus came to be,//
how did he come to be? one book says he is David's descendent through Joseph.. that means Joseph had sex with Mary.. other book says Joseph never had sex with Mary and it was the Holy Ghost.. so, how did Jesus come to be?
//how the world came to be,//
6000 years ago.. yeah, right
//how u should "try" to live your life,//
uhum.. Old Testament anyone? Oh.. wait
//how our messiah lived a PERFECT sin free life//
got any record of this chap's life from when he was a Kid to when he reached his thirties?
//I could go on and on,but I won't knowing how some of u guys don't like to hear the christian girl ramble//
As the great Robert Plant once said.. Ramble On -
dsriharsha said, "Lot was considered a just man.. go figure"
I am lost as how lot got brought into this.
dsriharsha said, "...Joseph never had sex with Mary and it was the Holy Ghost.. so, how did Jesus come to be?"
Yes. Immaculate Conception.
dsriharsha said, "6000 years ago.. yeah, right"
Where is that written in the Bible?
Oscar Gecko now says, "dsriharsha, what do you think the purpose of the Bible is?" -
@oscargecko
dsriharsha said, "Lot was considered a just man.. go figure"
I am lost as how lot got brought into this.
Holly said
//A book from our creator to show us how to live//
A man who gave up his daughters for rape and in fact had sex with them himself was named "Just".. that is hardly the way we should live
dsriharsha said, "...Joseph never had sex with Mary and it was the Holy Ghost.. so, how did Jesus come to be?"
Yes. Immaculate Conception.
quote the full sentence for the context.. I was pointing out the contradiction in "Virgin Birth" and you use "Immaculate conception"? you know the difference or just want to use Catholic terms to scare me off?
dsriharsha said, "6000 years ago.. yeah, right"
Where is that written in the Bible?
are you stupid? The Bible wasn't written in the 20th century.. why would it mention the figure "6000".. the number is derived from the Biblical dates and timeline.. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young_Earth_creationism#Age_of_the_Earth
Oscar Gecko now says, "dsriharsha, what do you think the purpose of the Bible is?"
The purpose of the Bible(in the form we know today) was to Unify the citizens of Constantine under one religion with one central scripture to control them in an effective way -
Lot was first and foremost a human. To call him just his whole life depends on a whole bunch of semantics. Was he just? At one point in time, yes. Does that make Lot a perfect role model? No.
Side note: The Bible says that only one man walked the earth was just. That was Jesus.
But what does Lot have to do with showing us how to live? Let me answer that... It means that no matter what you did, your sins can be forgiven. Even after the crap that Lot did. I will not even go into the whole question of "once saved, always saved" vs "Losing your grace" argument. That is out of the scope of the original question. Maybe I should start a new topic on that????
Virgin Birth/Immaculate Conception.. I do not care what you call it. (BTW, I am not Catholic.) Mary had a child WITHOUT having sex. It IS something that happens in real life. Do a search for "parthenogenesis."
And the wikipedia link only shows one THEORY about how old the earth is. If I had to pick an age for the earth, that would be my first guess - yes, a guess. But it is not a sure thing.
And thank you for your thoughts on the purpose of the Bible. It is much appreciated. -
Lot offered his own 2 daughters for rape.. and later had drunken sex with them both.. yet he was called Just and Righteous.. now, if he was called that in the book based on his life before the incidents, it would have been alright.. but he was called Just in the New testament in Peter 2 which makes it ridiculous
But what does Lot have to do with showing us how to live? Let me answer that... It means that no matter what you did, your sins can be forgiven. Even after the crap that Lot did.
Lot was born long before Jesus was born to die for his sins and he couldn't claim Jesus died for him, so why exactly were his sins forgiven? If God forgave sins at random, why forgive such a person and yet kill people for offering a different fire or work on Sabbath.. what sort of life did the Bible want humans to live?
Virgin Birth/Immaculate Conception.. I do not care what you call it.
Virgin birth is the doctrine that Jesus was born off a virgin.. Immaculate conception is the dogma that Mary was conceived without sin.. both are as different as chalk and cheese.. don't use terms if you don't know what they mean..
(BTW, I am not Catholic.)
That explains the ignorance in the above context.
Mary had a child WITHOUT having sex.
Read my posts again.. one account says there was no DNA from Joseph in Jesus, other account says Jesus had Joseph's DNA.. My question in this context was not how Virgin birth is possible but rather did it take place, because the Bible is not clear..
It IS something that happens in real life. Do a search for "parthenogenesis."
I did. Did you? If you did, did you read this bit : "The offspring produced by parthenogenesis are always female in species that use the XY sex-determination system."
And the wikipedia link only shows one THEORY about how old the earth is.
Calculated from dates ages provided by the Bible.
If I had to pick an age for the earth, that would be my first guess - yes, a guess. But it is not a sure thing.
So you do not believe that the Bible is the Ultimate truth and bla bla.. ? You do not completely by the creationists' nonsense on age of earth? wonderful.. there is some hope for you after all
And thank you for your thoughts on the purpose of the Bible. It is much appreciated.
No problemo.. my pleasure -
Ugh.. it pains me to try to repeat myself over and over again.. So what is the point?
You accused me of taking your words out of context, yet you are doing the same. So again, what is the point?
I am done with this part... no sense... you are right and so am I. -
Ugh.. it pains me to try to repeat myself over and over again..
then don't repeat the same wrong points.. once I make a rebuttal, you should respond to the rebuttal.. whats the point in going back to the same point? and stop being melodramatic.. you haven't repeated yourself.. you have failed to answer any questions I raised
You accused me of taking your words out of context, yet you are doing the same.
did I? where?
So again, what is the point?
My point initially was to comment on Holly's reply which I felt was misinformed and so I offered my critiques of it..
you then came butting in responding to me with religious concepts you didn't know about(immaculate conception), questioning a Biblical concept that Christians apparently believe in, and put in a scientific explanation which contradicts itself(Jesus had to be a girl by your explanation)..
my point then became simply correcting your mistakes and explaining why some of the stuff you said wasn't right.. got it?
I am done with this part...
but you haven't answered my questions yet
no sense...
Religion seldom is
you are right
Yep.
and so am I.
about the previous statement, yes.. about the discussion and your replies, no. -
Hello??? Is there anyone there?
I was talking about you, and you turned it into an argument about religion? Are we talking about the same thing here?
[I am done with this part...
but you haven't answered my questions yet]
I did... go back and remove your planned disruption and look at it again. -
I was talking about you, and you turned it into an argument about religion? Are we talking about the same thing here?
I always(almost always) argue about the topic in hand, and not the person(mostly)
I did... go back and remove your planned disruption and look at it again.
ok.. I will not respond to the "planned disruption" but lets see if you answered my questions..
1)On the subject of Bible telling us how to live life, I mentioned Lot and his deeds and how he was still called a "Just" man, to which you responded by saying this "Just" man was not a role model which I agree. But then you said the lesson is God forgave sins, to which my reply was God forgiving sins was a concept after Christ, with belief in Jesus absolving sins but Lot was born too early for that, so it wasn't a good example. Also I mentioned God wasn't very patient with sinners in the Old Testament citing breaking Sabbath etc..
Waiting for your reply..
2)On the subject of Bible telling us how Jesus was born, I mentioned the contradictions because a)the Virgin Birth theory b)He is also supposed to descend from David(seed of David etc) through Joseph which would contradict the Virgin birth theory. Your response was simply "Immaculate conception" which is completely different from Virgin birth. I pointed out the difference and you didn't respond to that. You also mentioned parthenogenesis which might explain the Virgin birth but doesn't resolve the contradiction I stated.. moreover I also mentioned that parthenogenesis produces only female offspring and not male.. you still haven't said how there wasn't a contradiction, yet
3)The age of the earth according to the Bible is 6000 years old and while I think that is complete nonsense, you were also skeptical about that theory so we are cool on that.. no problems there..
so, what about my arguments you found disruptive?
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I think the purpose of the bible is to give people something to post thread after thread about on internet forums...-
I do love a sense of humor. Thanks for keeping it (semi) positive. I do realize it could have been worse.
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what a wonderful way to kill time..
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The bible has many purposes, among them:
1) Speaking the ultimate truth.
2) Teaching people about the basic nature of humanity and it's role in the universe.
3) Serving as every childs first substitute for R rated movies.-
point 1 : disagree
point 2 : half agree
point 3 : partially agree(not everybody in the world is born in a christian family) -
Those are the answers I would've expected from you, and 3 was mostly meant as a joke.
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but 3 was more right than the other 2.. weird
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You'll find out whose right after your fatal accident next week.
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"You'll find out whose right after your fatal accident next week."
What a reply.. What brilliance.. what an insight.. Bravo.. you win -
Of course I win. Don't you know I always win dsriharsha?
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with nonsensical, off topic, personal attacks like that. how could you not Jeremy?
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My apologies. I went too far.
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The purpose of the Hebrew Bible: to tell the story of the Jewish people's mission on earth and their relationship to God.
The purpose of the New Testament: to tell the story of Jesus and his message of salvation to the world -
jeremyjanson, i noticed you are fond of putting people's ideas down. you can state your facts but no need to put them down-
I apologize if I come off that way. Mostly I just believe in being very frank and I know sometimes my stubbornness kind of gets in the way.
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apologies taken .if you want to be a friend you have to knock softly as if entering another friends door ;)don't worry in time we'll get well.
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And this is why I'm gonna try so hard again not to talk about my faith to a room full of athiest and agnostics.
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I do not refrain. I have found that an atheist's questions and ideals have strengthened my faith. They were meant to tear down a person's faith. But, when analyzed critically, it can tear down the "religion" that man can get into and leave behind a more solid faith in God.
My only issue is when the comments are pointless and disruptive. If someone wants to change my mind, it has to be thoughtful. If it is not thoughtful, then it is just a waste of time and worth nothing. -
Yeah I've actually found that too. Especially a lot of the angst and points about various theologies (like the "Man exists to Glorify God" theology) that really do not represent God. And also when I read about a lot of the pain that people have felt and what not. I will admit though that at times I also have been hurt by bad ideas. Christians are especially vulnerable because we take so much on faith, and therefore are left gullible. That's part of the reason why religious dialogue is important.
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The comments of an atheist are not "meant to tear down" another person's faith. Rather than impute an intent that serves the religious by making them look like a poor little Christian victims of the big bad atheists, why not view the atheist comments without that filter? You could learn something useful.
An atheist is a person who simply does not believe that an invisible magician created and controls the world.
I do have to wonder, however, why you seem to think that an atheist comment aimed at tearing down a Christian's faith is a bad thing. Isn't the object of evangelical Christianity exactly the same with regard to people who do not share their own beliefs? Or do they walk the streets and knock on strangers' doors with the intent of communing with the like-minded? -
OK. I stand corrected. They are not always meant to tear down. A good majority are. There are some whom are genuine in exploring questions and want answers.
My basis for my faith is simple: Don't believe it just because it is written. Take it as written in the Bible or Science books.
I do not believe every word a preacher says and I do not believe every word someone thought up either. I test everything for myself. I study everything for myself. That is the filter I use.
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Oh I agree that faith based dialogue is important. I'm just gonna talk to the ones who can help me build on my faith not shake me down anymore. I think I almost became one of those fanatics who was just looked at as crazy, I don't like to feel that way. So instead I'm just gonna keep good company and say HOLLA to the rest.
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the purpose is to save those who believe in Him.-
I thought those who believed in him were already saved?
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The old testament is simply a book codifying the legends and beliefs of the ancient Jews.
The new testament is a chronicle of the life of Jesus, through the eyes of multiple individuals, none of whom actually knew Jesus. Like the old testament, it is a compilation of stories written by people who weren't there, along with some editorial material.
Both books were put together by a Roman pope and some advisors several hundred years after the death of Jesus in the Middle East. They had hundreds of texts to choose from, but they choose just these because these served the purpose of the church.
The purpose: it was a political document put together to ensure the power of the church and the pope...which become so elevated that, for hundreds of years, the pope and his minions were more powerful than kings and had the power to appoint emperors. -
Great question.
It is a hotchpotch of all sorts of things. As it stands now, it is a mix up of religious doctrine, history of the Jewish people and other tribes. It also includes some very interesting information written in something called the Sound Current (Shabda). It is folk tales, parables. It has been butchered by fundamentalists who wish to control humanity and also a group of controlling aliens, the head one being Jehovah, who has claimed to be God (as in the Father, Allah and the formless absolute). It also includes information about the Kabbalah and prophecies of things to come and twisted prophecies that were seen out of the body by some of the seers. And it also contains a very small section of the life of Jesus. It includes the wanderings and ideas of some of Jesus's great followers and also some who were not so accurate in their information and understanding.-
Agreed, for the most part. But the OP asked for its purpose. What do you think is the purpose of the compendium?
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Well I'd have to break that down
Churches - Control
Aliens - Control
Sages - To remind us that something maybe doing something
Sound Current Masters - to show that what is present in other faiths is also alive and well and hidden in the Christian Faith
Kabbalists - Something to play with
Jewish People and Tribes - So the ancestors would have an idea of the history and there would be simple stories to inspire them about their God
Real Christians - something to have as a reference to guide them and give them warnings for the future / present
Fundamentalists - to use to bash other people over the head with-
Thank you... That is an great breakdown. I do agree with some of those points. Even the one about the Fundamentalists. They tend to... er... they do usually use it to bash someone over the head.
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To spread awareness about the dangers of sodomy and incest. -
B asic
I nstructions
B efore
L eaving
E arth-
I love that mcoy I'm sooo gonna bm this thread now
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@ SweetViolet where you said "none of whom actually knew Jesus."
Have you actually even read the Bible??
Mathew, Mark, Luke & John were Jesus' disciples and were with him for many years so that only leads me to think you haven't actually read the Bible yourself. through & through.
Why would you say that? What foundry is there for saying that? Some people are just plain wrong.
The Bible is Gods revalation of Himself to us. (In a small but basic way)-
Uh, yeah...I have read it. I was a Baptist as a child, I converted to Catholicism as an adult and I was a catechism teacher before the scales fell from my eyes.
Were the gospels actually written by those apostles or by others, many years later, who codified the oral traditions? I'm not going to tell you...I'm going to let you look it up for yourself.
The gospels contradict each other, you know.
The old testament also had multiple authors who contradicted each other.
And it was a Catholic pope, in Rome, hundreds of years after the death of Jesus, who put together the bible as we know it today. He left out DOZENS of other available "gospels," the contents of which did not support his political purpose. A millennia later an English king rewrote it and left out some stuff that gave the pope the right, directly from the hand of god, to appoint kings and emperors. That became the Protestant bible.
If you want to argue about the bible, it is a good idea to research the subject first. -
The history of the Bible... Are you making reference to "First Seven Ecumenical Councils?" And (with no official proclamation) King James? Or the "Apocrypha?"
I am already aware of those controversies. Aside from the fact that those same controversies were created by man. They all add to and/or take away from the Bible. I try to let the Bible speak for itself.
And the contradictions. That is what you call them. To me, it is more about being misunderstood. Just because it doesn't make sense and at first "appears" to say two different things does not mean contradiction.
You will find a deeper understanding if you look deeper and leave out all of the BS rules that men tends to add. -
There are none so blind as those who will not see.
The Bible was put together from a bunch of old texts by a Catholic pope and his advisors. It was done for political reasons...virtually everyone except the nobility (and priests came from the nobility) was illiterate in those days, so the purpose was aimed at nobles. The pope was "God's emissary on Earth" and texts that did not serve the authority of the Church and the Pope were omitted.
It was a document of political power and intended to ensure that kings and princes understood that they ruled through Divine Right...and the Pope, as emissary of God, was the guy who said who had the right and who did not.
James I and VI rewrote the Bible for essentially the same reason, ensuring that HIS bible did not allow for the Pope to appoint kings...at least not in his kingdom.
In neither case were the texts the word of an invisible magician, they were legends, stories, codified oral histories, letters, journals and other ephemera, cherry-picked by a political committee and published as the word of a god in order to scare the superstitious (which was pretty much everybody back then) into following the party line.
Now, you can sugar-coat it any way you choose, but that's the unvarnished truth about the origins of the bible. -
You are an excellent writer. You have invested a lot of time and thought into what you believe. It shows... you present a strong argument.
Yes, the Bible, as we know it, has been under the control of human hands. Either these human hands have had the honor to be the keepers, or it is as you say, a cover up for a hoax.
As part of this cover up, the pope (religious leader) has edited or omitted any of the "texts that did not serve the authority of the Church and the Pope." And who would dare oppose them after this was done. To do so would be to oppose God.
What if a man were to question them? Would he be an outcast? And if he would effectively lead people away from the pope? -
Uhmmm...
What if a man were to question them? Would he be an outcast/excommunicated? And if he would effectively lead people away from the pope? -
Oh, no response.
SweetViolet said, "...published as the word of a god in order to scare the superstitious (which was pretty much everybody back then) into following the party line."
My point was simple. If you use that argument that the Bible is for scaring people into social control, you forgot the stories in it. Like when Jesus stood up against the Scribes and Pharisees. They were the religious leaders wit political clout of the day and he said they were wrong. Not the story I would teach if I were using it as social control I would pick another book.
I find it typical that people who do not agree with the Bible say you should not believe everything you read and are told. And they often paint a rather dark picture about how the Bible was derived. Where did they find those facts? Did those facts come from a book? Did those facts get taught or told by someone?
The story of social control makes no sense. "Now, you can sugar-coat it any way you choose."
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur.
It is a matter of perspective. Think about it.
oscargecko.blogspot.com/2009/05/religion-as-social-control.html
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To scare the s--- out of people (o_0) -
To be a guide to life -
Mind control.-
Mind control?
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Mind expansion more like it.
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The main purpose of the bible is to show us how to make it to heaven.... Acts 2:38 -
Every book is written to be read -
John 3:5... sorry
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I can whack my brother with the book-
There have been times where I was tempted to do that.
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Everything in this universe is in a continous state of evolution and the human mind is also a part of that everything if you follow something which was valid a few thousand years back you are putting a stop to your natural evolution process and enslaving you mind to an irrevelant idealogy.-
That's right, the history of the universe is the Second Law of Thermodynamics is at work; the dispersion of Energy
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The basic nature of people doesn't change. Abilities may change, but what we value on the spiritual level, human relationships, and basic human tendency will likely never evolve, as can be inferred by their shocking resemblance to what is seen in animals.
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What evolves are alternative ways of dealing with that nature. Freud said: "Civilization began the first time a man hurled an insult rather than a stone." We can learn to control our actions, if we make the effort.
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Absolutely NP. And, in fact, in the bible you do see a progression to what we would consider a more civilized society from the Torah (with it's "eye for an eye" justice) through the prophecies (with their "you wicked, come to the well and be made just") to finally the New Testament ("Forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.") You just have to know to read the bible as a whole, as supposed to snipping out little passages and using them to guide your life. But the basic relationships and lessons of the bible and the many stories in it are timeless.
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On that we absolutely agree. Religion, philosophy, psychology all attempt to furnish us with tools to refine and civilize our nature.
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Great insight.
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I love discussing with you NP.
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Thanks JJ. I'm blushing. Look how red I am.
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The purpose of the bible is to help us to understand their will be sins and mistakes but also ways we can correct those errors in everyday life in order to get to heaven and have peace. -
Bookend, door stop, hotel drawer filler... The possibilities are endless and if all else fails you can even read it.
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