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Should the World consider bombing or invading US?
Posted by redfinger • 9/18/07 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
The major argument of pro-war vultures these days - Iran is helping world terrorists and will use nuclear weapon soon as it get one.
Hm, as I recall, and correct me if I'm wrong, USA helped regimes through out the world for decades, orchestrating coups and training terrorists (sic! - Bin Laden is their homeboy) and also posses nukes with some already used (Hiroshima and Nagasaki).
So, should the World consider bombing and invading USA?!
User Comments
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Why to bomb or invade anyone ? Ever? -
yea they can TRY, I doubt if they would survive an attack with the military might the U.S has.
I know the U.S has a bad rep for stickin it's big red white and blue nose in other countries affairs, but sometimes I wish non Americans would not look at the USA like we are some kind of GOD. I mean stop talking about America and focus on your own issues for a change. FREE DENMARK DAMMIT!
I feel really Guilty because I hate certain countries. Would I bomb it? NO
Why? Because I have a conscious.
Why do people around the Globe focus on what we are doing while they do nothing when people are being slaughtered? Coward Wankers.-
yea they can TRY, I doubt if they would survive an attack with the military might the U.S has.
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THAT is the sort of arrogance that makes terrorist WANT to to try.
You yamnks have to stop "bigging" up yourselves.
THAT is your main problem in my eyes.
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Of course, I'm all against war in any form, but I simply refer to the arguments that pro-war so-called ,,experts,, make to justify another war, now on Iran. And we all know it's about oil, nothing else. And if we look back, US have done and still does the same that Iran is accused of. Actually Iran doesn't have a nuke. It's a double-standard world we live in...
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In the words of the late Warren Zevon: "Send lawyers, guns and money!" -
If you decide 'yes' drop me a line first, kay? I shouldn't be held accountable for the sins of others.
War is never an answer, bombing a place is never an answer. -
OK let's do this, I'm President Zawadi Moofasah ok? I will not do anything and let IRAN and anyone else do whatever they please and make as many missiles as they want and some little ones to stuff in their jacket with ducktape. incase they see something they don't like- like a person carrying a Bible.
We all will sit back and chill over some lemonade at my beach home and talk about underwater basketweaving.
While we do this.... Guess what? you will be in for the biggest suprise of your life. We will become like Europe, no ty, I love them - but hell no.
"While Europe Slept" Read the book ok....
I don't plan on being like my ancestors before me..
I am trying to not speak how I really feel so I must sound like a lunatic, but I have a deep hatred for somethings that I cannot let go of.-
It's pretty easy to sit back in the comfort of our homes with our freedoms and say that war is never an answer.
zawadi has a very valid point here.
During World War II, the Americans were isolationist. They didn't get involved until the very end.
While some people were sitting back saying, "Let them work out their own problems with Hitler" and "Oh, let's not go attacking anyone", Jews and many others were being slaughtered.
Bush scares the heck out of me, but let's not get mixed up between politics and the principles of humanity (*disclaimer - not that I have the market cornered on any of that)
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Instead of always holding my breath I will join the Proud Infidels and Blog about it. Make a blog to make them wanna point one of their goat skinned covered missiles at me lol
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First, we don't all know it's all about oil. That is a belief you share with a large number of people, but that's a lot different from all of us knowing it.
Second. I have been in combat. I know what it is. I also know that the U.S. did nothing to spark the war in your region, and only entered the conflict when Europe chose to do nothing to stop what was happening there.
Third. As an American Military Veteran my country's failure to respond to the horrors in Darfur (and Rwanda) are points of great personal shame. But the logic that we failed to address the one situation means that we should ignore another is terribly flawed. I hope that we one day learn that suffering on the African Continent is just as tragic as that on the other Continents.
The reason that Iran is a priority for the U.S. over Darfur is that darfur is not a credible threat to the interests of the U.S. Iran has the potential to sting us (and the desire of those in power), Darfur does not. Oil is not necessary in such a risk assessment.
Fourth. "What is happening now" is wrong only if one presupposes a motivation of conquest, as you do. If one allows that there might be other motivations, the frame of judgment shifts.
You say you are against war in any form. Does this mean, in principle you feel the U.S. the UK and the U.S.S.R. (note that one could find them selves disliking one or more and yet liking the others in this group) did evil when they prosecuted a war against Germany and Italy in WWII? Should any of them stood back and refused to do anything based on the fact that fighting Hitler would have been the moral low ground?
I would submit that as long as some would use force to do ill, others must be prepared to use force against them.
Yes, the world has many double standards. I have knives. I don't allow my children to use them. I have fire arms. I don't want people recently paroled from prison or released from mental health institutions to have access to them. Double standards are not an absolute ill.
[edit] for some reason I just can't put a post where I want it tonight. This was a response to redfinger's posts, not zawadi's[/edit]
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Dear Zawadi, have you ever been to war? Have you experienced the horrors of it? I had it here, on the Balkan peninsula, for the last 15 years in different forms.
So tell me, you sitting in USA, who's next on your list for elimination in the quest for ultimate justice? How many innocent will die because someone thinks he is a crusader?
And don't tell me that u don't agree that it's all about the Benjamins?
Why there is no intervention in Darfur still? Why is Iran top priority? OIL...
USA should lead the way coz it's one of the greatest countries in the world. But it's simply wrong what is happening now...-
maybe i'll get answer here if not directly using your shoutbox - are you from macedonia?
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I forgot to mention - the question in the title of the discussion is a purely RHETORICAL one.
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ok, i'm from Zagreb, Croatia. You and me should know the best that the war is never a solution. People responsible for the war rarely get punished for what they did. It's the common people who suffer the most.
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Exactly my point, my friend. That's why I reply to Zawadi that USA should lead the way as one of the most powerful nations - they must change the system within and help the rest. Let's be real, they have the power to change the world, coz new way is needed. This one is paved to hell.
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The USA should Not Lead anything... NO NO NO...
We have done enough sending our young men and women to die for ungrateful wankers.
I feel for the people who need help, I love Africans, they are MY PEOPLE and even closer to HOME is Hati, this is MY Blood, and When Katrina Hit Louisiana, that Was MY Blood being spilled.
Don't speak to me about injustices ok, there is to many to speak about when we talk about a Nation of People with me.
Now as for policing the Planet... I say allow other countries to take a bigger role in this since for years they sat back and watched them die on the BBC -
Dane, I appreciate the response and I agree with it in some points. But...
Darfur - U say that Darfur is not a priority over Iran, coz Iran is a potential threat and Darfur is not to US? So, if one man is dying and other seems to be a potential threat to me in some future times, shouldn't I be first helping the dying man and then, only then, turn to the ,,potential,, one. No excuse for such tragedies.
War - I wish there will be no war at all. But I didn't say that I wouldn't defend. But preemptive war? C'mon, let's not argue about it. It's against all principles. U say u have knives at home. If I as your neighbor got in dispute with u over some issue, and I see that u have knives or weapons, should I attack your house coz I have reasonable doubt that u can use that
weapons on me at some point. In the criminal law it's called assault, and it's not preemptive self-defence. -
DaneMorgan
I understand all that you write here and I wish I didn't feel so much hatred for certain groups on this planet. I have a history that just screwed up my views about The Middle East.
I just can't top asking myself... why do the World SIT and point the finger at the USA for not running when they can do something? They didn't even urge
China to STOP supporting Al Bashir. Never will they speak up until Americans get arrested for protesting. Then they come out like they LOVE humanity.... It just makes me sick.
I try to contain that when I speak here lol-
I've been in more countries than there are states, zawadi. I've met people from all corners of the globe (I love that expression). I've come to realize that hatred toward any large group involves hating many people who do not represent the ideas of your hate. To hate Middle Easterners" or "Americans" (a continent, not a country BTW) or "Jews", or "Inert some group here" is to hate young children anticipating their birthdays, old women sad for the choices their children passed up, Mothers worried about the next meal, fathers wondering about their families future, young couples experiencing their first glimpse of "forever". All of these people are a part of what you hate when you hate a large group of people.
I understand that it can be hard to let go of something that brings hate to ones heart, but I think, from your words, you understand or soon will, that it is a thing that scars you and bleeds your humanity almost more fully than it ever can your enemy's. I think this was a lot to do with what Jesus was saying when he said to love your enemies as you love yourself.
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OK Zawadi, we won't bother u anymore. But only when you pull YOUR army bases from all around and return YOUR soldiers home. I agree with you - no more troops out of US (to kill the ungrateful ones - the wankers that is)
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What good would it do you to get started assisting the dying man if you were slain by your attacher before you could aid him? Sorry, but this point is driven home very clearly and starkly in combat at the tactical level and it seems to scale to the strategic as well.
The discussion of knives was to illustrate the point that double standards were not automatically a bad thing, it did not address the preemptive use of force.
That said, If I have firearms, and I have demonstrated a propensity and a desire to use them, and I make statements that at the next opportunity I intended to slaughter your children with them, the only rational act left to you is to initiate force to prevent me. For most individuals afforded the luxury, that might involve calling the police and telling them about the threats. But if You are the police, who do you call?
Preemptive acts of war by Kennedy kept nuclear missiles out of Cuba, and very likely prevented an invertible exchange were they present there. So the alternative to that preemption would have been tens or hundreds of thousands dead in the best case scenario, and world wide nuclear exchange in the worst. Obviously I would argue that preemption can be a very good thing.
Clinton had a couple of preemptive opportunities against UBL, but did not take them. We paid the price for that "principle". -
Ok, I ment ,,man in trouble, need,, not ,,dying,,. Pardon my bad English, Macedonian is my native tongue after all. Still, I understand the weapon-talk, but u didn't mine, obviously.
And that u r the Policeman, we all know. But isn't Police to protect and to serve, not to steal and murder?
Preemptive actions? On such scale as invasion - no way. Single actions towards
persons - maybe (I'm not THAT naive and budism-loving after all
How about Guantanamo? From legal point of view that is major civil rights abuse. Imagine your kid being there with apsolutely no rights at all.
You mustn't compare with the terrorists and say LOOK WHAT THEY R DOING, SO WE HAVE RIGHT TO THIS! Build a just society and better world, not eye-for-an-eye one.
My friends, I need to go to sleep coz in 4 hours time I need to be fresh at work. It's 04 AM here in this time zone, so 'night y'all.-
But the people in Darfur are dying.
If in my analogy the man is not dying them the imperative to face a threat before turning to aid the man in need.
If you simply want to find fault with the US that shouldn't be too hard. But I reject your characterization of the US as intent on stealing and murdering. A good point in case is that we have had these weapons all this time since WWII and since that conflict how many times have we used them?
I'm curious how you define "absolutely no rights at all". I'm not saying that I agree completely with the course the current administration has taken in playing semantics with the idea of "prisoners of war" vs "enemy combatants", but the fact is that no one but the suicidal affords prisoners taken on the field with the exercise of all the civil rights recognized and protected for their own civilian population. However suppression of certain rights does not equate to "absolutely no rights at all". But I'm not certain how this enters into whether or not the US is prosecuting a murderous rampage of lust and gluttony through the world.
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Do you know how many dirty bombs are in the US still waiting to be released? It's alarming that there are more than 100 dirty bombs missing from the United States government. That's what I fear the most.
War is never the answer, but has been from the beginning of time. Sad. -
One side of me wants to give redfinger the um...middle finger and say "Bring it on" the other side (the side that knows what its like to feel hatred for a group of people) wants to join him then another side wants to raise a white flag and give up, while yet another side wants to say "Can't we all just get along?"
I think I'll go make a grilled cheese sandwich.
Frank. -
I agree that, that is the real question.
war is for death lovers who run this world.
nada -
"So, should the World consider bombing and invading USA?!"
The victims of 911 would argue this has already happened...
The unidentified 911 attacker(s)? accomplished nothing other than generating more warfare and causing the deaths and sufferings of thousands of humans...
The U.S.A invasion of Iraq however well or ill intentioned has not solved anything so far other than ridding the world of Saddam Hussein...
Traditionally the reward for killing an enemy is creating new enemies as evidenced throughout history...
War has always been the problem and never the answer...
We must all drop our swords and fight pollution, global warming, hunger and poverty instead of each other.... -
Oh, I am sure other nations are just waiting to press some button to start WWIII and begin their sick and evil deeds in the US of all places.
I mean, the US is hated, I mean, really, really hated, right? -
As sad as it is, it is human nature to fight and destroy. Mankinds only predator is man after all.
Name one point in human history that didnt involve conflict. As much as people wish it, the Star Trek eutopia is a fantasy that will never be achieved unless you lobotomize the entire planet.
Blaming the U.S. for current wars is todays new Russia (cold war. all bad guys on TV were Russian). Tommorrow it will be someone else. People believe the U.S. fights for oil (a statement made without looking into patents held by large companies,) tommorrow it may be christianity against Islam (again.)
The only thing an individual can do about it is become a politician or a member of a political party and try and prevent it. -
I want to move to another Planet. Take my family and just leave lol
I never served in the Military, but I was an Army Brat.
I really don't hate People, I need to make that clear. I hate Governments and Policies where little girls are hanged and imprisoned for things that they had no fault too, like being raped or molested. Countries that would let their children grow up thinking that Jewish people are Pigs and so forth.
Making cartoons to spread the hate to younger children. So yea I hate this.
I do Feel we need to help, Darfur, and places like it. I don't believe the Middle East need the U.S there, they cannot live under a Democracy, they have lived under a Theocracy and always will. Unless they change their Doctrine (again). Sharia Law stinks and so does anyone who support it.
I don't understand how people of any group can scream the name of God while killing children. -
Well I heard the US is the most heavily armed nation in the world (90 out of 100 have guns), so if you see the mess in Iraq, invading the US would be a catastrophe. So we'll just let them be.-
Errrm, how do you destroy a first world power? Cut off the electricity and let the indigenous population do the rest. Just think of all the things you would lose if the power went off for let us say 6 months while they rebuilt the power stations. Barbarism hides in the dark waiting for the flick of a switch.
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We don't have to bomb them or cause any death to US. Just boycott US in any military actions and that is sufficient to cripple them somewhat.-
exactly.. Boycott, keep Everyone Focused on The Policies here in the USA and maybe some changes will happen.
Americans used to be this way back in the 50's 60's and 70's. I don't know why we all went to sleep.
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GrimlyFiendish, The British Empire fell and so did the Roman Empire and The Empires before America. The USA will have it's time in history like all others and then change happens.
How did the Citizens defeat the British Empire during the American Revolution?
Farmers and Peons and Slaves defeated a Empire and there was candle sticks no light switches lol-
Money, personal information necessary for loans, house purchases, medical histories, police records, traffic lights, security cameras, burglar alarms, containment/control circutry for nuclear power plants, radar, air defences, medical equipment, life supports in hospitals, factories, pc's used for blogging, credit cards, printing presses, air conditioning, navigation equipment, anything that requires a manufacturing plant, and anything else that requires electricity.
The British empire, Roman empire etc were not 100% dependent on such things. LOL
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,,exactly.. Boycott, keep Everyone Focused on The Policies here in the USA and maybe some changes will happen...,,
I agree, and as I've said before - Americans themselves must change America, so that America can change the world. I started this discussion not because I hate USA, but because I love it as a great country as it is. America with its (not-ideal) model of the society, as an Idea must be one of the world's engines towards prosperity - but not via death and bombs.-
I agree, and as I've said before - Americans themselves must change America,
SPOT on....
so that America can change the world.
NO... not at all.
Why do you have to make yourselves like some heroes we ALL need?
Don't you see that is exactly how people see it outside America?
Just as you also said...NOT via bombs and death...
BUT you have done that, and you will NOT get rid of that stigma in OUR lifetimes.
So it's a simple case of you Americans change America... thats it.
The world will change itself anyway...and we can only change ourselves.
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I hope not I live here. I don't agree with our president and didn't vote for him twice, but if anyone tried boming or invading the US we'd stomp a mudhole into them.-
Ok for your country to bomb the shit out of baghdad tho?
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Remind me exactly why America must change?
Saddam Hussein butchered hundreds of thousands of his own people and gassed thousands more because they weren't. Afghanistan suffered at the hands of Al Qaeda. Darfur is a nightmare. Zimbabwe defies description. North Korea is run by a nuclear weapon wielding film nut. The Congo is a no go zone. Iran is a puppet government run by an Iman. God knows how many other places are hell on earth. Its not America that should be boycotted or changed.
If America is guilty of anything it is getting involved without the backing of other nations and being stupid enough to listen to people who complain about their inability to police the whole world on their own.
All the other first world democracies seem to take it upon themselves to bitch and moan about all the atrocities committed in these countries but when the call comes to do something about it they are all having there hair done.
Yes, "The U.S.A invasion of Iraq however well or ill intentioned has not solved anything so far other than ridding the world of Saddam Hussein..." but if the rest of the world backed the whole thing instead of turning their backs to mutter in dark corners then maybe the results may have been different.
As for people hating Americans let us just say the Welsh hate the English, the Irish hate the English, the Scots hate the English, the English hate the French, the Spanish hate the Portuguese and visa versa, the French don't like the Germans and anybody who was on the other side of the Berlin wall hates the Russians. -
There are plenty of things about my country I'd like to see a little different. None of those things have anything to do with the whims of people not from my country. Just as I'm sure most people from other countries aren't real interested in changing their culture to suit someone on the other side of a big pond.
One thing I wouldn't want to change is anything that left us sitting around hoping and thinking nice thoughts when people from outside attack us. One thing I would like to change is our attitude toward Africa. Our bombs and our soldiers have been very welcome in all of the regions represented in this conversation at one time and another.
No one from the Balkans tried to ethnically cleanse Chicago. The Reich never bombed Denver. Somali warlords never starved any one in Dallas. It seems after a while that when we bring our might to bear to defend Europe it's okay, but when we do so for our selves it's wrong? Maybe if we stayed home France and Germany would ensure that our interests were protected for us?
I'm sorry. I'm getting harsh. I promised my self I wouldn't do that, so I'll bow out of this conversation. No one in this thread is going to alter events in any case. -
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you keep dropping that same link in quite a lot of threads, I've noticed...
This one is two years old. Quite spamming.
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instead of bombing the US, why not get a visa, come here for yoursel, meet the nice people of the US and then see if you still want to bomb us? i'd even take you to a strip club and buy u a beer -
LOL, Do you want every living thing on the planet to cease to exist, because trust me, you try and do that to the US and we will unleash hell on Earth. This country will never accept being invaded. Never.
You try to wipe us off the face of the Earth and we'll taking the whole world down with us.-
i promise you!!!! as the daughter of immigrants who came here with less than 100$, i can tell you and attest to the fact that America is the greatest country on earth and this has nothing to do with quality of life or values but the fact that in this country if you are willing to work hard you are getting somewhere is beautiful the fact that people want you to success and live the "great American story of from nothing to greatness" is unparalleled. I love my home country but had I grown up there, i wouldn't be free, a free woman. who has her future and choices in her hands. I love America, the beautiful Home of the Braves and real freedom fighters!!
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My Grandfather was fighting a losing battle in the Philippines against the Japanese in WW2. He had to watch his friends get slaughtered as they were being mowed over by the Japanese. When the United States came and saved the country he was more than happy to join and serve in the U.S. military. He would soon move his family to live in the U.S. permanently as U.S. citizens.
When asked what he thought the U.S. he was more than proud to say, "I would die for this country." I'm American through and through, and if anyone tried to invade this country, I'm prepared to die for this country too.
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