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Soul
Posted by angelshair • 11 days ago • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: soul
Do you believe in the soul ( in the fact that we all have a soul)?
If yes:
Do you communicate with your soul, and how?
User Comments
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Here's Platos definition of a soul:
"he Platonic soul comprises three parts:
1. the logos (mind, nous, or reason)
2. the thymos (emotion, or spiritedness, or masculine)
3. the eros (appetitive, or desire, or feminine)"
from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul#Socrates_and_Plato
So, you speak with your soul by way of developing your character. -
Yes I read that definition. Is it the one you believe in?
So how do you communicate with your soul? or how do you develop your character?-
I believe in this definition and believe as a Christian this is what Christ was referencing in John 3, certainly explaining why he was so disturbed that Nicodemus did not understand what he was saying (Isreal had been highly influenced by the Greeks and Greek philosophy since the time of Alexander.) There is a ressurection of the body.
You "speak" with your soul by developing it and guiding it and nurturing it. It is intrinsic to you. Everything you do affects your soul. -
I agree with that "everything you do affect your soul". But my question was how do you manage to know what your soul likes or dislikes, wants or does not want.
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Interfaces pretty readily with your emotions. If you feel a little sick at an action, or a deadly calm, or despair, or isolation, that indicates a weakening or spiritual pain. If you feel deep satisfaction or security or a strengthened bond with someone else, or really deep, self-sacrificing love, you know your soul is healthy. Most of your emotions tell you something about your soul.
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Interesting.
I am playing the devil advocate here:
If you feel deep satisfaction with your friend's wife and great desire for her, does that mean that it is your soul that is speaking? -
The Eros is, but the remainder of the soul may be speaking quite differently very soon. Just because you feel this immediately doesn't mean you won't feel differently later. That's where principles come in.
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Yes in this case, it might be eros and thymos. 2 against one. If they manage to convince logos, then is it ok?
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No, because in the long-run all 3 will suffer. And this is where guilt and despair and a lack of self-identity come in. It's a Net. loss.
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Only as a metaphor.-
Would Plato's definition come close? Not exactly a metaphor but certainly an intangible.
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Sorry NP, do you mean that you believe in the soul as a metaphore?
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Yes. It's not an actual thing, the way a rock or tree is. It only exists in language.
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Yes but a metaphore of what?
I agree with you that it is not anything tangible.
Do you think you can communicate with this "intangible"?
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It's not an "intangible"; it's nothing. It's an invention, like a unicorn.
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So it is just a metaphore of ourselves.
Do you put the dreams in the same level as the soul and the imagination?
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I believe u are your soul. You don't communicate with "it" you live and you learn,and on the way you nourish your soul by how you live.-
If you are your ssoul, how do you ( from the religious point of view) separate from it when you die?
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Your body is just the shell. We look at ourselves 2 different ways,u and I.
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Yes, that is true. I look at myself compound of 3 parts:
body mind and soul.
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Well,I look at myself as Holly livin in this temp.body for a minute,but there's better things to come
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The "I" of I am a body which may or may not have a soul.
The "I" of I am a soul. I temporarily have a body.
Without knowing, I have a choice, I prefer the latter. -
Indeed, there is much more poesie in the second choice:-)!
I choose to believe that I have a soul, a mind and a body that can communicate each other ( I don't know if my english is correct here:-). In fact, I am a very complex person. -
As I can see...
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I'm not a complex person.
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Thats untrue -
@ Holly, you said in a precedent thread about the soul that it is possible to loose your soul. If one can loose its soul, what stays in the body then?
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If the soul were really so nothing why is it left constantly questioned? Nothing is nothing and nothing more.
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Your high priest assures you are are different from a sophisticated machine. You have "soul", whatever that means-
Christ was probably referencing the Platonic definition, which would've been well understood in Isreal at the time.
"Sometimes I wonder if they'll laugh when I die,
Why am I fighting to live,
If I'm just living to fight,
Why am I trying to see
When there ain't nothing in sight?
Why am I trying to give,
If no one will give me a try,
Why am I dying to live,
If I'm just living to die." (2Pac)
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soul is energy.(and it never gets destroyed..but assumes different forms)
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ps:iam sleepy -
AngelsHair,
This is what I posted in a similar thread.
www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/entry/the-definitive-proof-of-soul
We usually grasp our soul as a principle of life ("I live"), as it is connatural to our internal life [as a principle of our vital operations].
For us, to live is to exist, and to exist is to live. Therefore, our substance (what comes first in the order of Being) is our soul.
Having a direct affective knowledge of our soul is as much an advantage as an inonvenience. As we can take a great liking to our soul, it is possible to never leave it to reach substance - i.e. to never abandon the viewpoint of the living and switch to the viewpoint of Being. In fact, this is what characterizes most any neoplatonian.-
@ Harveyavatar,
Thank you for the link! It was very interesting, and I wish I had enough courage to start reading Aristotle.
In fact, this is the definition of the soul I mostly adhere to.
However, for me this "first being" in my body create another being which I can call my mind. I believe that the I of my mind can communicate with the I of my soul. -
AH,
Actually, Aristotle's metaphysics has not always been translated correctly... I preferred to read other realist philosophers who have fully understood the Stagirite and this been able to take hime further... like "Avatar"
In realistic philosophy, the mind (intelligence) is a potency of the soul.... intelligence is said to emanate from the soul.
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Soul as in a ghost or spirit, no.-
I am intrigued.
How do you explain intuition and memory? What about the feelings you have just before sleep, when the body is passing out of conscious thought? What about inspiration and imagination? -
All brain.
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Truly? Just electrical impulses of the central nervous system?
And you find that explanation intellectually satisfying? -
Absolutely. These are all functions of the brain.
A mysterious mystical and elusive soul as in a ghost or spirit certainly is not an "intellectually" satisfying explanation to me. -
I wonder at your description of the soul as 'mysterious and mystical' and 'elusive'.
For some, it is a familiar component of the self.
I wonder also, if the aspects of experience ordinarily attributed to the soul are merely brain impulses, do you imagine that other life forms have the potential to develop a similar self-soul-concept, were their brain function to evolve similarly to ours? -
My description of the soul as 'mysterious and mystical' and 'elusive' is as debatable as it being considered as a familiar component of the self. Any attribute we apply to it can no more be confirmed or denied than another.
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If you do not believe in the existence of soul, because of its intangibility, then, in full logic, you do not believe in the existence of "man", or "chair" or "car"...
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exact, of love, hate, etc..
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The reason I do not believe in the soul is not "because" of it's intangibility, I don't believe in the soul because there isn't evidence that it exist in the first place, and there are natural explanations already known to exist that explain these things much better, like the brain.
The idea of a soul comforts and satifies those that want to live beyond death. -
The life beyond death is not my concern here.
My concern is purely philosophical. Science is not the only answers to our questions here. In fact the answers science can give me right now about this subject are very poor.
Philosophy at least leaves the gates open.
All I know is that I am not just a body. That every night "I go" somewhere else and explore others dimensions.
That as Midwestmomsaid, I have intuition, imagination....a great imagination in fact etc... and I know science is working on finding the answers. But will they be ever satisfaying? I don't think so, there will always be a missing dimension.
Like Einstein said in one of my favorite quotes:
"It would be possible to describe everything scientifically, but it would make no sense; it would be without meaning, as if you described a Beethoven symphony as a variation of wave pressure." -
I really do wonder when scientists will finally understand that Becoming is the HOW and Being is the WHY!
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angelshair, If the mystical idea of a soul motivates and inspires you, and you call that a philosophy of some sort, than more power to you. But it still doesn't explain anything. Personally, I understand that one can't imagine, dream, be intuitive, be inspired, etc... without a brain.
Also, Einstein often said that science doesn't motivate and inspire people, but feeling music, being touched by art, etc... does. If belief in a soul does this for you, very well than. -
harveyavatar, apparently you are smarter than scientists since you understand this.
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Being is not the realm of science. Most scientists are incapable of entering into metaphysics/first philosophy, in as much as they are immersed in quantity. So, no, I am not necessarily more intelligent than a scientist. That said, your intelligence will only take off if it is linked to what is.
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Well, if you want to believe in the soul because um... I don't know why, then fine. But I remain unconvinced. And that is what the OP asked for, if we believed in the soul or not. And I do not. I have no reason to. There is no evidence of it and it doesn't explain or account for anything.
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Most people are not interested in truth, even when it stares them in the face. Imagine, something that is not yours to possess!
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"Most people are not interested in truth, even when it stares them in the face."
I would have to agree with you on that! -
@morgantj: But indulge me. Regardless of whether there is an ETERNAL, SUPERNATURAL soul or not, what do you think about Plato's definition, which could indeed be carnal and certainly includes the carnal?
FYI: The Bible speaks of a resurrection of the body. The soul is important because, in Chrisitianity, it and your memories are really all you leave this world with. So no, this is not a religious idea. -
Yes, the soul is a religious idea as well - "Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it" - Ecclesiastes 12:7 According to Christiantity, when people die their souls will be judged by God and sentenced to an eternity in heaven or in hell.
As far as Plato's version of the soul, I'm not sure what to think of it yet. -
Interestingly, "spirit" does not necessarily mean "soul." Indeed, "spirit" may in Ecclesiastes just mean vitality and life.
EDITED: I searched "soul" on BibleGateway, and found that all O.T. references (at the verse level) very clearly use it for an individuals essence, attitude, and inner strength. The New Testament is consistent with this although less clear in its usage. Here's my search results:
www.biblegateway.com/keyword/index.php?search=soul&version1=31&searchtype=a...
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In the order of life, soul can be induced as the principle (or common denominator) of all our vital operations.
In the order of existence, soul/substance is induced as a principle of our concrete (morgantj) and abstract ("man") modes of existence. It is thus neither concrete nor abstract, but nevertheless to be found at the heart of reality, whether it serves to comfort or not...-
The idea of soul functions well in that it inspires like a poem does.
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A principle is not a being of reason (universal) or a product of intelligence, not in the least!
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The explanation is simple. Poets are liars and they invented the soul because it's enchanting to imagine that such a thing exists.
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NP,I do agree poetry is one of two neoplatonian tyrannies we are faced with - the other being mathematics and positivism, which produce a primacy of scientific knowledge over all the rest.
However, a principle (soul is the principle of life and Being) is at the heart of reality, and one can even go as far as saying there is nothing more real than a principle. -
We are in a poem, other wise it wouldn't be called the universe(hence uni and verse, one section of a vast poem.)
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:D) Jamber, are you really fourteen?
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Yes, but maybe not in the way many feel. Whether it's energy, emotion or what have you, I feel that our soul is the presence that we give to those around us. And when we die that impact we have on all people will be remembered and carried on. So people just make bigger impacts than others.
But that's just my take on it....-
So is it the others that defines your soul?
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There Is A Mass Of Flesh And Blood Inside, Apparently Which Also Beats, Beats Like A Drum, And Is Responsible For ALL The Unbearable Lightness & Heaviness We Carry, Carry As If A Cross, Throughout Our Life. May Be I Am Right, May Be Not, But If There Is A Soul, This IS It! -
Souls are more like a name of the mystery of consciousness than a solution to it. How are we conscious? By means of a soul, What is a soul? Something that makes us conscious. How would you call this an answer to the question?
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