Discussions
Spirituality Vs Enlightenment
Posted by Dukepro25 • 7/23/08 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: Enlightenment, Spirituality
Some people suggest that Spirituality is directly tied to faith and religion.
Is spirituality directly related to faith and religion or is it independent?
Is enlightenment a better term?
Do you think that religious people are less/more spiritual than those who are not religious?
Are eastern societies more enlightened than the western societies?
Is it better to be spiritual or to be enlightened?
Or, are they basically the same thing?
User Comments
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Define Spirituality and Enlightenment please.-
They are adjectives, labels that we humans created to explain the unexplainable. I am that I am - defined by my own actions and existence - a label added to my name will not make any damn difference who I am!
Are you happy my friend? Then you are enlightened.
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Spirituality
1. the quality or fact of being spiritual.
2. incorporeal or immaterial nature.
3. predominantly spiritual character as shown in thought, life, etc.; spiritual tendency or tone.
4. Often, spiritualities. property or revenue of the church or of an ecclesiastic in his or her official capacity.
- dictionary.reference.com/browse/spirituality
Enlightenment
1. the act of enlightening.
2. the state of being enlightened: to live in spiritual enlightenment.
3. (usually initial capital letter) Buddhism, Hinduism. prajna.
4. the Enlightenment, a philosophical movement of the 18th century, characterized by belief in the power of human reason and by innovations in political, religious, and educational doctrine.
- dictionary.reference.com/browse/enlightenment -
It's funny that you mention this because I have often thought the same thing. I believe that Spirituality and Enlightenment are two separate things. Spirituality in my opinion comes from a belief in one God where as Enlightenment is a feeling of oneness and understanding. I also believe that religion is a man made organizing of Spiritual beliefs (somewhat like a club which can be good or bad).
I don't think it is better to be one or the other I think it just depends on what your belief is. Your beliefs come from experiences in ones life and these experiences determine your acceptance or one or the other.-
Excellent explanation.
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okay, I think it is better to be enlightened.
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My perception is this
Religion = the study of God
Spirituality = supposedly things that relate to the Spirit, activities that supposedly enhance ones progress on a supposed journey to some place
Enlightenment = Knowing the is no other
(Put a helmet on)-
I like your definition of spirituality.
Personally, I don't think you have to be religious to be spiritual.
Enlightenment is more, being in touch with the oneness?
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I took this philosophy of religion once and my prof said that he was an atheist but believed in spirituality. so it is possible to be spiritual without being part of any organized religion.
As to enlightenment, they say it cannot be explained in words, it is indescribable... so i'm not even going to go there (verbally) and can't really imagine it (but hope to one day in one of my future lives to experience it)-
Very good.
I like your explanation.
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it is better grasshopper to know nothing that way you have everything to learn....personally spirituality and religion to me are over intellectualized why not be grateful for the next breathe why does it have to be anything more and why a separate entity to life itself and does setting yourself up as enlightened make you part of an elite group a homeless man can be just as enlightened just as spiritual just as religious as the next-
Agreed
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Who said anything about the intentions of being enlightened is to be part of an elite group?
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@Robin
We were not assuming that.
Everyone is entitled to become enlightened. -
If you "know nothing" then you would not know you needed to learn anything. Therefore, even with everything there is to learn, you still would not have the knowledge of that nor know the need to learn those things because you "know nothing." You would parish rather quickly.
Also, if it is better to know nothing because that way you have everything to learn, why would you want to learn those things? Because if you started to learn those things, that would put you back at square one, You would no longer know nothing, you would now know some things and thus you no longer have "everything to learn." The better state you said was to "know nothing" so you can have everything to learn. Therefore, you must remain at knowing nothing.
Unless of course, you take back what you said because you really do think it is better to know things, rather then to know nothing. -
My head hurts. lol
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You're only a movie and three hits of acid away from enlightment
www.amazon.com/UNIVERSE-Cosmology-Quest-Dr-Halton/dp/B0006HU2VY/ref=sr_1_1?...
and I am joking about this just so you know.-
Oooook...
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And if you prefer an organic approach you can buy some Sonoran toads.
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LOL
I'll pass.
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I heard some jokes:
When a coconut fell into your head that is enlightainment and when you believe that it as enlightainment that is the start of Spirituality -
I'm very aspiritual. ("a" being the Latin prefix for "not")
However, many atheists (including Richard Dawkins) are spiritual in a metaphorical sense. I'm an exception in this case.
Enlightenment is good. I like enlightenment, because there's no wrong way to be enlightened.-
"I like enlightenment, because there's no wrong way to be enlightened."
lol
Agreed
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Which reminds me why don't Buddhist monks ever use novocaine at the dentist's? (it's a joke, a bad one, but it somehow fits in this discussion, i think, or else i licked one too many toads)
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Because it alters their state of being?
IDK - lol -
Because they transcend dental medication ... lol
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lol
I get it!
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Personally I think it's rather silly to separate them as they are both means to improve oneself.-
I like the way you think.
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I don't think that people of religious affiliations are less spiritual, however I do believe that religion cannot define spirituality. You cannot put into words, what an individual feels exclusively. I believe that we are all one and the same as however you define God. So even Atheists get it, because they believe strongly in themselves. There is nothing more that you need and people have the ability to take joy in knowing that we are all connected on the underlying layer of fabric. I completely agree with what Jeunelle said. Self growth is the key to happiness. -
Before the definitions where laid out, I was inclined to think they were the same. But now, I think that spirituality is believing in a higher power. Don't agree that atheists can be spiritual but can be enlightened. Enlightenment is more about being open minded and believing in oneself-
If I am in "awe" of the grandness of the universe and I feel practically one with the tree branches and leaves blowing in the wind, and at the beach, I feel the awesomeness of depths of the ocean, the surface, the crashing of waves, I feel one with the sand and the ocean. I feel a "oneness." with nature.
Is this spirtual, a degree of enlightenment, or neither? -
It's secular spirituality.
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I'm an extremely spiritual person, who does not believe in a Supreme being and who has utterly rejected the doctrine, dogma and all the accouterments of institutionalized religion such as practicing rituals, retelling myths, revering symbols and/or other humans, or accepting certain doctrines about deities and afterlife.
I believe ONLY in what I personally experience. My personal experience is that once individuality, personality, and ego are entirely extinguished via meditation, I experience -- pure consciousness.
In other words, what I experience is that when I meditate and all the things associated with the self like greed, anger, hate, etc, etc - dissolve there really is no self, there is no distinct being that is separate from the universal stream of pure consciousness. -
@DukePro25
Some people suggest that Spirituality is directly tied to faith and religion.
Q: Is spirituality directly related to faith and religion or is it independent?
A: Spirituality is independent of faith and/or religion. On one hand, there are legions of atheists, agnostics and secular humanists who are aware of their spiritual nature. On the other, some people who are aware of their spiritual nature are members of faith groups and/or religious denominations.
Q: Do you think that religious people are less/more spiritual than those who are not religious?
A: I come from a very large family full of religious people, who are not IMO in touch with their spiritual nature at all. The religious people who comprise both sides of my family are loathe to even learn how to meditate because they say such a practice is "not of God". This is despite the fact that New Testament writings indicate that Jesus instructed his disciples to "mediate".
The greatest barrier I had to discovering my spiritual nature was all the religious doctrine, dogma, rituals, myths, reverence for symbols, objects and certain people, and doctrines about deities and afterlife that I had been brainwashed with from infancy onwards. However, once I severed the chains of religion I quickly learned how to meditate and experience pure consciousness.
Q: Are eastern societies more enlightened than the western societies?
A: I'm not aware of any "enlightened" societies. I am only aware of people, who experience "nirvana" ie. the cessation of all ego driven desires and individuality during the time frame when they are in a meditative state.
“There can be no political revolution, no social revolution, no economic revolution. The only revolution is that of the spirit; it is individual. And if millions of individuals change, then the society will change as a consequence, not vice versa. You cannot change the society first and hope that individuals will change later on.”
- Osho” -
@ Time Thief isnt the ascension close -
Awesome summation and follow up to the OP.
You've made all excellent points. -
Q: Do you think that religious people are less/more spiritual than those who are not religious?
A: I come from a very large family full of religious people, who are not IMO in touch with their spiritual nature at all. The religious people who comprise both sides of my family are loathe to even learn how to meditate because they say such a practice is "not of God". This is despite the fact that New Testament writings indicate that Jesus instructed his disciples to "mediate".
The greatest barrier I had to discovering my spiritual nature was all the religious doctrine, dogma, rituals, myths, reverence for symbols, objects and certain people, and doctrines about deities and afterlife that I had been brainwashed with from infancy onwards. However, once I severed the chains of religion I quickly learned how to meditate and experience pure consciousness.
I have also come to find this out.
So...I guess a couple of follow up questions would be these...
Are religious people more gullible and naive than those who consider themselves more spiritual than religious?
Does a person's spiritual/religious profile (preference and/or belief) have any relation to their IQ?
I’ve heard it said that Atheists have a much higher IQ than religious people.
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I believe it is not necessary to be religious to be spiritual. You can stay spiritual even if u don't adhere to any set of customs, rituals and beliefs. Spirituality is a way of staying at peace with yourself. Religion might guide you on this track (or atleast the part of my religion that I am aware of), but only if you interpret it for yourself instead of buying others views on that.
Enlightenment according to me is the higher state or aim of spirituality.
Are religious people more gullible and naive than those who consider themselves more spiritual than religious?
I guess people who do not think and follow blindly are always more gullible.
Does a person's spiritual/religious profile (preference and/or belief) have any relation to their IQ?
You are kidding... right?-
"I’ve heard it said that Atheists have a much higher IQ than religious people."
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If it helps them to sleep at night, then sure, why not.
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Religion is most like a computer virus for brains. It comes complete with instructions for development and propagation of the virus, and code that prevents the person from deleting it or noticing that it doesn't conform to reality. It is orchestrated, organized, and officially sanctioned psychosis, made easily digestible and palatable to the masses.
Learn to think before you learn to believe, or you’ll soon believe that you don’t have to think. -
not the same -
Being religious is being bound by rules and all about beliefs whereas spirituality is not being tied by any rules and it is never limited in belief but rather works on just the "knowing"...
Best example I can quote here is: Your friend eats a sweet dish and tells you it is sweet... Religion is the friend here and being the percentage of being religious is directly equal to the percentage of trust you have in that friend.. but when it comes to spirituality it is actually tasting the sweet to know it is sweet.. Here you never rely of information or knowledge through any source but you witness and experience it directly..
Religion is a preacher of religion telling me that he can heal me, I believe in him and get healed.. Spirituality is when I know I can heal myself, believe in myself and get healed... -
@morganT
"If you "know nothing" then you would not know you needed to learn anything. Therefore, even with everything there is to learn, you still would not have the knowledge of that nor know the need to learn those things because you "know nothing." You would parish rather quickly."
'I am therefore I need be nothing more'and who would make the judgment of what I needed to know....and would not that judgment be merely a perception of what another believes...and does not experience come without having to seek it....
"Also, if it is better to know nothing because that way you have everything to learn, why would you want to learn those things? Because if you started to learn those things, that would put you back at square one, You would no longer know nothing, you would now know some things and thus you no longer have "everything to learn." The better state you said was to "know nothing" so you can have everything to learn. Therefore, you must remain at knowing nothing."
'I am therefore I need be nothing more' Something is a nothing unless given meaning so as life flows towards me I experience everything yet remain in nohingness which would be the place most seek when seeking enlightenment'
"Unless of course, you take back what you said because you really do think it is better to know things, rather then to know nothing."
If I were to say I know you I know things about you would that be knowledge or purely perceptions based on beliefs? I come to you with nothing then I do not bring to you judgment or assumptions or expectation
but hey just my way of looking at things it may not be yours and thats okay -
spiritual is base of everything... -
Religion and spirituality are 2 different things, it is a chance that we can have a spirituality without being in a religion. we can have spiritual growth and not been following a religion, and you can be following a religion, and have no spiritual growth. In my understanding spirituality is
in opposition to material, it is about this unmaterial thing that is our spirit. We all have one, religion or not.
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