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The Great Hypocrisy About Sex and Condoms in the Philippines
Posted by earthlingorgeous • 8/31/08 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: church being hypocrite, sex and condoms
I think the Church is being hypocrite about the reality about sex and condoms and use of other forms of contraceptive method.
Please join my poll and read the two post I wrote about the issue. It's been annoying me for the couple of days since it's everywhere in the newspapers here in the Philippines.
Hope to see you there and hear your opinion about this matter. Thanks a lot.
earthlyexplorations.blogspot.com
User Comments
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I'm very unclear on your use of the word "hypocrite". I get that you disagree with the church's position--many people do. But "hypocrite" means one whose actions contradict his stated positions. So it would, in fact, be hypocritical for the church to state the positions that it does about the use of birth control and then advocate condom use.-
it will be clear to you when you go read my post. The Philippines is a catholic dominated country and so I say they are being hypocrites because they know what's happening.
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I did read your post. I was still unable to reconcile your terminology with what you said, which was that you disagreed with the church's position, not that the church was contradicting itself.
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I disagree their position and the Church being hypocrite as well, like TT mentioned below they are being hypocrite because they are doing it too but they are trying to appear clean about these stuff that is the hypocrisy about it.
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Wait, who is the "they" that are "doing it too"? What TT mentioned below is that many members of the church use birth control. I agree that someone who professes to be Catholic and uses artificial birth control is behaving hypocritically, but that clearly isn't what you meant. So are you suggesting that the church leaders who oppose the distribution of condoms are using condoms? That WOULD be hypocritical, if you have any support for that.
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Wait, who is the "they" that are "doing it too"? What TT mentioned below is that many members of the church use birth control. I agree that someone who professes to be Catholic and uses artificial birth control is behaving hypocritically, but that clearly isn't what you meant. So are you suggesting that the church leaders who oppose the distribution of condoms are using condoms? That WOULD be hypocritical, if you have any support for that.
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YUp the Catholic Church leaders.
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I didn't see the part in your post about the Catholic church leaders using condoms. Did I miss that?
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I didn't have to state the obvious in my post
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Okay. Confused, then, as to why you referred me to your post to make it all clear, but I honestly don't care enough to invest any more time in trying to sort out what really amounts to nothing more than "I disagree". I got that part. Many people do.
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Uhmmm if you gonna take your angsty annoyed picky mood on me... I will not reply to your comments. Thank you.
Anywho you said you don't care enough but just to annoy and be picky? and yes I disagree what's your problem about me disagreeing you haven't even said if you agree or not and not even mention your opinion but just to be overly critical
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There is no biblical basis found in scripture that negates birth control and family planning. The position of the Roman Catholic Church is that use of anything (medication, condoms, or any device or technique, etc. including oral sex and mutual masturbation) that separates sperm from egg and prevents conception is sinful. The doddering old fools that maintain this position do so despite the fact that most couples among their membership ignore it completely.
Setting that aside, the fact these doddering old fools have been protectors of the pedophiles within their institution, who have sexually molested children and been "forgiven" and hidden away the offenders away from legal prosecution.-
Timethief, do you have any capacity for disagreeing with someone without name calling? It's such a disappointing foil to the fact that you often provide very interesting insights and valuable resources when you can't seem to express an opinion without using phrases like "doddering old fools".
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Yes I have that capacity but you can slide that style of manipulative rhetoric you just used on me right up where the sun don't shine. IMO the pope, archbishops, cardinals, etc are doddering old fools. And the rules against demeaning personal attacks pertain only to BC members.
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I wasn't talking about rules, just the basic concept of civilized discourse.
Edit: Which, your latest rewrite makes clear you have no interest in: "Yes I have that capacity but you can slide that style of manipulative rhetoric you just used on me right up where the sun don't shine." So never mind.
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whoz stopping you at the moment of using them ?? huh-
not just me LOL... the whole population of my country... the Catholic Church is stopping us. LMAO!
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I fail to see the correlation of the Catholic Church and hypocrisy as it relates to birth control and use. The Dept of Health wants to distribute condoms, not the Catholic Church. Perhaps you are implying that those in the Dept of Health are Catholic and pushing decisions that are in opposition to the beliefs of the Catholic Church and, hence, are hypocrites?
Perhaps you have other sources?
Health Department’s condom plan provokes CBCP official
MANILA, Philippines — An official of the Catholic Bishops Conference of the Philippines (CBCP) on Saturday described as “highly dangerous" a reported plan by the Department of Health (DoH) to distribute condoms to the public as a means to controlling the spread of HIV/AIDS.
"That decision, if such a decision has in fact been made, appears to us as completely irresponsible and imprudent," Pampanga Archbishop Paciano Aniceto said in a statement.
"It is dangerous to the public health, offensive to the common good and should be revoked. The mere timing of the announcement provokes legitimate questions about the real motives of the department," said the bishop, who heads the CBCP's Episcopal Commission on Family and Life.
"We are inclined to view this as an underhanded way of subverting our strong moral and constitutional objection to the proposed legislation and confronting the nation with a fait accompli bereft of any moral basis," he said. Source: www.gmanews.tv/story/117199/Health-Departments-condom-plan-provokes-CBCP-of...-
like I said read my post I indicated a source in there too and like Madame X question about not getting the hypocrisy thingy TT explained the matter very blatantly.
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Your response is unclear.
The Catholic Church is not making the rule to distribute condoms. Hence, the "Church" is not being hypocritical.
Now, have leaders in the Catholic Church been hypocritical? Absolutely. Pedophiles/child molesters are cases in point.
Regarding hypocrisy as it relates to your post, I fail to see the connection. -
ITS NOT THE CATHOLIC CHURCH ITS THE GOVERNMENT WHO WANTS TO ADVOCATE CONDOM AND CONTRACEPTIVES
THERE IS PART ONE AND PART TWO -
Exactly. So, please tell me how the Catholic Church is being hypocritical regarding condom distribution?
I think you may be bringing in the issue of pedophilia in the Catholic Church and the irony that some priests have raped boys and girls yet denounce the use of condoms. Is this correct? -
It's a little known wicked secret and what's this sacrament about confessions (that's what they use to hide their dirty little secrets).
I am not pointing my finger at pedophilia and the church people doing it, its just the sexual act and being responsible about sex. -
@earthlingorgeous
Take a step back for a moment. There is no biblical basis found in scripture that negates birth control and family planning. The position of the Roman Catholic Church is that use of anything (medication, condoms, or any device or technique, etc. including oral sex and mutual masturbation) that separates sperm from egg and prevents conception is sinful. The wages of sin are death.
The Roman Catholic Church relies on dogma and doctrine created by men, as opposed to scripture to justify their stand on humans being fruitful and multiplying endlessly. The Roman Catholic Church fathers created their own rules and they are directing their members to uphold them. That means you are not correct when it comes to the use of the word "hypocrite" in this case.
The Roman Catholic church is an institution and like any institution is fixated on self perpetuation. Without a membership who are producing children that can be brainwashed and become lifelong members of the institution where would their funding come from?
What in essence has happened since the very early days is that the Roman Catholic Church fathers have created a dogma and doctrine that is of their own making. The members of the church must agree to ascribe to it and if they don't then they have become hypocrits and sinners.
Madame X is taking this stand and dwelling on the incorrect use of the word hypocrisy. If the RC church fathers claimed their dogma and doctrine on birth control and abortion were supported by scripture then they would be hypocrites. Instead they claim it's tradition to avoid being called hypocrites.
IMO the stupidity factor here is with the people who choose to be members of such an institution. -
Yup but the Catholic Church is making it appear that if you use one you are being immoral and that you will go to hell and that you are killing person already (a sperm is a person? duh) Therefore my term HYPOCRITES.
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GG sorry about the all caps my little bugger
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Feature Article, 26 July 2008
Sex and the modern Catholic
Publication of Humanae Vitae 40 years ago was a seismic moment in the history of the Catholic Church. Today most practising Catholics ignore its teaching on birth control and more than half think it should be revised. This is the central finding of a major survey commissioned by The Tablet.
It's interesting to note that respondents were asked about their awareness of Humanae Vitae. Sixteen per cent were fully aware, 37 per cent somewhat aware, 47 per cent not aware/never heard of it.
www.thetablet.co.uk/articles/11769/
Take note that it's the RC church father's position that the sexual act is aimed at only one purpose and that is to please God by conceiving children. Finding pleasure in the act is secondary. The RC church teaches that contraception is evil aka sinful. The position is that contraception violates the dogma and doctrine stating that the very purpose and nature of the human sexual act is conception, and therefore it violates the dignity of the human person.
www.vatican.va/holy_father/paul_vi/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-vi_enc_250719...
www.papalencyclicals.net/Paul06/p6humana.htm
www.goodmorals.org/smith6.htm-
awesome TT thanks for the links
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I think everyone who intends to have sexual intercourse should wear and use contraceptives. There are far too many unwanted pregnancies and the world is overpopulated already. Aren't we tired of child prostitution, child abuse, child slavery, child hunger, etc. ? Only those who will be devoted to their children should have them. I am Roman Catholic and I use good common sense, when it comes to human nature and temptations. Perhaps people wouldn't feel the need to have abortions. There are of course differing circumstances, whereby people must choose what they will do, but in the big picture, everyone needs to control themselves and use protection.-
Exactly Theresa.
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@Theresa111
Sadly as you are an RC your very sane and sensible stance renders you to be an evil sinner bound for hell in the eyes of the pope and his entourage.
Edit: I'm sorry. I inadvertently posted the wrong information above on that last go round. I posted the abortion and excommunication information instead of the information on contraception.
Catholic Advocates Call On Pope To Lift Church's Ban On Contraceptive Use www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/116420.php
More than 50 Catholic groups in an open letter published Friday in Italy's largest newspaper Corriere della Sera called on Pope Benedict XVI to lift the Roman Catholic Church's ban on contraceptive use, Reuters reports. www.reuters.com/article/healthNews/idUSL2497501620080725
According to Reuters, the letter was published on the 40th anniversary of the late Pope Paul VI's encyclical "Humanae Vitae," which states the church's opposition to contraception.
Catholics for Choice, We Are Church and New Ways Ministry were among the groups to sign the letter. Jon O'Brien, president of Catholics for Choice, said, "We thought the establishment in Rome and the Vatican pay close attention to the Italian media and the letter would be seen by the people to whom we want to deliver this message." The Vatican said it likely would issue a statement on the letter on Friday, Reuters reports (Pullella, Reuters, 7/25).
www.catholicsforchoice.org/
www.we-are-church.org/
www.newwaysministry.org/
About 50% of practicing Catholics in England and Wales said they use methods of contraception banned by the church, according to a survey released Friday by the weekly Catholic magazine The Tablet, London's Times reports. www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article4393251.ece -
No communion and ex-communication for women who have abortions in the Catholic Church? Why do you think they did not do the same to the priests who raped and rape children? Clearly, something is amiss here. This is hypocrisy.
Note: I don't understand this business of no communion and ex-communication as I am not a Catholic. Nonetheless, child rapists should clearly be excommunicated and denied communion...and then castrated before being sent to an island amongst other perverts and deviants like themselves. -
God gave me free will, and good common sense. Since I was created in His likeness, He will not punish me for using my brain. Especially when I have such a great big heart. I am unafraid.
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Although this is slightly off-topic I'm posting the abortion, communion and excommunication links below.
Note: In the RC church the teaching re: the Eucharist (Communion) is that those partaking of the communion wafer and wine are actually and literally partaking in the body and blood of Christ.
No communion for pro-abortion politicians, Pope says www.cbc.ca/world/story/2007/05/09/abortion-politicians.html
About 90 per cent of Mexicans are Catholic, the largest number of any country after Brazil. Federal Mexican law allows abortion only in cases of rape, if the fetus has been deemed to have severe birth defects or if the pregnancy puts the mother's life at risk.
The proposed law to permit abortion during the first 12 weeks of pregnancy was approved by Mexico City politicians on April 24 by a 46-19 vote, with one abstention. While it would only apply within the capital, women could travel there to have the procedure performed. Prior to the law being approved Roman Catholic church officials in Mexico threatened that doctors and nurses who perform abortions will be excommunicated, along with pro-abortion legislators.
Roman Catholic politicians who support a proposed law allowing woman to have abortions in Mexico City should no longer receive communion, the Pope said Wednesday in a statement clarifying earlier remarks.
The statement, which stopped short of saying the politicians should face formal excommunication, was issued by a Vatican spokesman, Rev. Federico Lombardi, and approved by Pope Benedict XVI.
May-10-2007 Vatican tones down papal remarks on pro-abortion Catholic politicians
Catholic News Service
SAO PAULO, Brazil (CNS) -- Pope Benedict XVI's comments on excommunication for pro-abortion Catholic politicians touched on huge and sensitive issues -- so sensitive that the Vatican issued a toned-down version of his remarks the following day.
Speaking with journalists on the plane taking him to Brazil May 9, the pope left the impression that he agreed with those invoking excommunication for Catholic legislators in Mexico City who had voted in April to legalize abortion. www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0702642.htm -
I am definitely against abortion though... Abortion is something different it's no longer prevention but killing as you can't abort something that has not existed yet.
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@earthlingorgeous
The reason I posted re: abortion, the eucharist and excommunication was to illustrate the point that the members of the RC church are volunteers who are being bullied and threatened by the Pope and church fathers AKA abused by their leaders. As they are volunteers RC members can use their free will to choose to place their reproductive affairs into the hands of those who bully and threaten them. Or they can use the brain between their ears, turn their backs on this institution and leave it.
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I will preface and say that I'm not Catholic. However, one of the issues I take with this whole debate over contraceptive and religion is this: God is bigger than contraception. If He wanted a child to be conceived, a piece of rubber isn't going to stop it. Afterall, He didn't allow the fact that Mary was a virgin prevent the conception of Jesus. On the other hand, however, I do attest that there are some forms of birth control which allow an egg to become fertilize but not implant in the uterus--and this I take issue with. I believe that life begins at conception, and if you are taking a medication to prevent a conceived child to come to full term, then I can understand why the church takes issue with it. -
I would not go so far as to call them hypocrites, but their position does have a touch of irony. I wrote a bit on it as well:
cosmopolite-kaffeeklatsch.blogspot.com/2008/11/on-bishops-politicians-and-t...
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