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What Causes Police Brutality? (multiple choice)
Posted by Agit8r • 3/24/09 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: donut withdrawal, police brutality, power tripping
What causes renegade police to beat/excessively tase/kill civillians?
A) Inadequacy issues
B) Hopoglycemic stress from missing donut break
C) Steroids
D) A desire to have control over some aspect of life
E) Glamourization of police brutality in movies
F) Add your own
User Comments
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Because of the Stress of the Job
Because EVERYONE hates you for WHAT you DO when you're actually out trying to save the world
Because the criminals are a bunch of jerks who don't care for humanity or the life of others
Because the criminal is fighting when they could just relax and follow orders
Because no matter what a police officer does, he's going to be painted as the "bad-guy" in every situation
Because the bad-guy is the same bad-guy who destroyed your partner's career or life
Because the bad-guy took one swing too many
Because the bad-guy is hurting others at the moment
Because the bad-guy is really really really bad and you have to stop him to keep other's alive
RENEGADE POLICE OFFICERS come from 2 different stocks:
1) jerks who sign up to the force just so they can be Jerks in Uniforms and they have Power Tripping Problems
2) Officers who just slip into a temporary insanity because the world has just cracked for them.
Being a police officer is one of the highest stressed, least appreciated, most underpaid position in the world.
It's a hard job - and those that do this thankless job with honor, integrity and a willingness to change life and help others -- THEY ARE AMAZING INDIVIDUALS - but even "they" get burnt after awhile.
I hate seeing posts like this - because while there ARE corrupt police officers and there is SOME corruption in Law Enforcement - the average police officer is someone who risks his or her life daily to save our lives and property and they are severely unappreciated and underpaid.
They are bound by laws to Protect and to Serve.
It's unfair when ONE is spotlighted and the REST --- the good ones - are ignored.
WagerWitch-
[Because EVERYONE hates you for WHAT you DO when you're actually out trying to save the world]
That's not how I see it. Most policemen are trying to perpetuate a bureaucracy by writing frivolous tickets and ignoring their rights unless the suspect acknowledges their rights.
For example, Florida Statute 790.01 does not define a pocketknife or a non-concealed knife as a weapon. It is a tool, unless concealed or wielded as a weapon. Dirks (3/4 daggers) and daggers (double-edged knives) are different, but a knife is perfectly legal to wear on your belt, in a sheath. Wearing one in a sheath does not count as concealment, either.
Both me and my dad have been stopped on separate occasions (him more times than I) for carrying a knife, and every time they try to play it off as if it's a weapon. Even when I insist, "No, it's a tool," they try to say, "What? This rambo knife?" The knife in question is a survival knife, similar in size to this one: www.wilderness-survival-skills.com/wilderness-survival-knife.html
Not exactly "Rambo" like.
I've never been arrested, nor has my knife been confiscated. However, these assholes are always looking to make an arrest, and they try to trick people into confessing to crimes they are not committing.
They also try to violate the fourth amendment with their DUI checkpoints, wherein they illegally search peoples' cars because the person in question is too stupid to demand they get a warrant.
The best way to get out going to jail for something frivolous and stupid is to demand they get a warrant. Say, "I have time, I'll wait. Go ahead and wake a judge up at 2 a.m. to get him to sign a search warrant," while calling your attorney to come down there to make sure they don't try anything stupid. Two can play the legal technicality game.
To say that some policemen are bad, but most are not is erroneous. Most policemen are willing to ignore our rights unless we acknowledge they exist, because it makes them money. If it weren't for easily disputable traffic tickets, fines, and bail costs, the police department would be practically bankrupt. Taxes only cover so much of their operating costs.
Policemen are not some virtuous paladins of justice. Policemen, who are often driven by their own terrible past experiences (such as bullying) to enforce (key word there) a skewed and imperfect view of what is just on people, are nothing more than bureaucrats with tasers and pistols.
I swear, I'm becoming more anarchist every day... -
@voodoo
You'd think a tool would recognize one, huh?
In this case they are probably trying to start a fight.
As for working inside a police department, i have cleaned both police and sheriff facilities. In my experience, the Sheriff's people tend to be a little more of hicks, but struck me as typically better citizens than the police (mind you there is surely some individual deviation from this general rule). It may just be the culture of that particular department, but in general the Sheriff's people would treat you as a human being, and the Police people would treat you as an annoyance. I'm sure that there is a certain amount of good and bad in both departments. Every town I have lived in, the police have tended to be snotwads. Outrageously anti-social individuals, who could not as a general rule expect to hold down any job that required people skills.
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OK
I think you and I see them in different light.
In no uncertain terms is it alright for a police officer to use his position of authority to: Threaten, Belittle, Hurt, etc. for personal gain.
I don't think Police Officers who beat others are "COOL".
I think that Police Officers - who have integrity, who are there because they BELIEVE in the code of law, who are honest and who do their jobs are AMAZING people.
But - there ARE those that don't deserve to wear the Badge.
Just like EVERY Profession - every family - there are black sheeps or rogues.
I don't think ROGUES are ok.
But I can say that I can understand "WHY" it could happen.
Now - as to YOU carrying that huge knife.
Hmmmm - what instance are you carrying it? Into the store/mall?
I think if I saw someone carrying a knife like that that I would be apt to freak out if they were in an Elevator with me.
I have no pity for Drunk Drivers - I have friends who were killed because of them. It's the ONE crime that you DO NOT have to commit. You must actively choose to drive after drinking. No Pity.
As to whether your state is allowing your officers to overstep their legal boundaries - that's up to your state and their politics.
IF YOU DO NOT LIKE YOUR POLITICS, I SAY CHANGE THEM. In the USA you have the ability to get involved in your politics. Get out there - volunteer, get involved.
Anarchist? Nah - just looking at the world without understanding it. Which each of us does.
We can ONLY see our own point of view because we only have our life experience and education to guide us.
"Most policemen are willing to ignore our rights unless we acknowledge they exist, because it makes them money. If it weren't for easily disputable traffic tickets, fines, and bail costs, the police department would be practically bankrupt. Taxes only cover so much of their operating costs."
I truly do not agree with this statement - can you please find some documentation for it? If it is only an opinion that's cool - because you are entitled to your opinion, whether or not I agree with you. BUT - if you think this is fact - could you please CITE where you found that documentation?
Most Police Departments are supported by Grants and state money. The state does not just collect on TAXES to pay employment costs. (You can insert CITY/BOROUGH/COUNTY for State). The State also employs stocks, investments, rentals, etc. to support their employees.
The pittance that is made in Traffic Fees is not given to the police departments usually. It is usually earmarked for the Department of motor Vehicles - or to the state itself. There are MOTOR VEHICLE laws and Criminal laws.
Usually MV laws subscribe to the fact that the crime is minor - therefore an infraction and the bailable "FINE" is supposed to teach the guilty party to "NOT" doing it again.
Again - if you don't like your laws - get involved in the law making process.
Don't complain if you're not involved. You have the right to vote - to petition and to overturn laws.
Most people who dislike police departments are people who commit crimes ---- OR have NEVER seen the Police Departments from the inside.
*end rant*
(actually - it's cool that you have a differing opinion - and I hope you don't take my opinion personally --- I do NOT intend to make ANY conversation personal. OK?)-
[Now - as to YOU carrying that huge knife.
Hmmmm - what instance are you carrying it? Into the store/mall?]
On the dirt road I lived on at the time, possibly going fishing. You don't know and the cops didn't either until I volunteered that bit of information early in their episode of harassment. And I'd hardly call it a huge knife. The blade was shorter than my middle finger.
[I think if I saw someone carrying a knife like that that I would be apt to freak out if they were in an Elevator with me.]
That's because you're insecure. I'm not. I don't even freak out of someone pulls a knife on me. I'll just disarm them and impale them on their own weapon.
[I have no pity for Drunk Drivers]
Me neither.
[I truly do not agree with this statement - can you please find some documentation for it?]
No, because these incidents go unrecorded. However, every incident I've ever had with the police, and a large percentage of the ones my dad and his friends (1% Motorcycle Club) have had with the cops, involved them trying to charge them with someething, my dad responding by citing a law (or the Constitution), and then (and ONLY then) the cop drops the charge and lets them go.
I see a lot of police harassment.
[Most Police Departments are supported by Grants and state money.]
The Lee County Sheriff's Office is partially supported by revenue from tickets. Not substantially, but enough to where it could serve as a motive to harass individuals.
[Most people who dislike police departments are people who commit crimes ---- OR have NEVER seen the Police Departments from the inside.]
Well, I have no criminal record and don't intend to have one. I like to carry my knife on me for two reasons:
1. It's damn useful. Opening packages, cutting things, etc. Wonderful tool. My dad's knife has a broken tip, so he uses it as a screwdriver when he needs one.
2. It's my right, regardless of what the morons who live in FL think. -
[As to whether your state is allowing your officers to overstep their legal boundaries - that's up to your state and their politics.]
They aren't being allowed to, they're doing it anyway because they don't have any authority nearby to keep them in check. If worse comes to worst, I have no problem with demanding they get their watch commander out here to settle my legal grievance.
[IF YOU DO NOT LIKE YOUR POLITICS, I SAY CHANGE THEM. In the USA you have the ability to get involved in your politics. Get out there - volunteer, get involved.]
The law is already on my side. It's just that I have to remind them that I have a right before the cops will acknowledge it, especially if it's something that most people wouldn't know. FL Statute 790 is my friend.
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I thinks it is a combination of things and not specific to any case of police brutality. Frustration, stress, anger, lack o' doughnnuts, personal bias, etc. I don't think all cases are just an officer getting up in the morning and saying "today seems like a good day to terrorize some innocents". -
@Wagerwitch: I can see both sides very clearly. As a former "counter culturalist," I've been on the receiving end of law enforcement that was enforcing prejudice and bias more than law.
As a middle-aged homeowner brutalized by burlars and landlord who caught a tenant selling the furnishings for crack money (and who had crack in the flat), I have experienced both compassionate caring and ineptitude so monumental that it should be made into a comedy.
Sometimes police brutality is in the eyes of the beholder: I witnessed something like the Rodney King incident across the street from my house many years ago. The suspect, a handcuffed young black man, was not struggling but the officers were kicking him anyway...I could see it from my upstairs window. I went out and told them to stop, then took their names and badge numbers and told them that I was going to call the station to make sure the suspect was taken to jail immediately (so they couldn't go around the corner and resume their assault) and if he wasn't there forthwith, I was going to report them. That, in my opinion, was brutality. But seeing a cop whack a suspect with his stick when the suspect was violently resisting arrest...that's not.
Voodoo is not wrong in his assessment and neither are you. There are cops who use their authority to hassle people; there are those who take their charter to protect and defend seriously.
As far as what causes police brutality, I think there are too many causes to explore in a place like this. There are people in this world to do things simply because they can, and they end up in all professions...I used to work for an attorney who knowingly flouted state labour law because she could--no other reason. So it's not surprising that there are brutal cops...just as I am not surprised when I see a police officer open the boot of his car and pull out a teddy bear for a traumatized child.
It takes all kinds to make a world...and all kinds end up in our police departments.-
[There are cops who use their authority to hassle people; there are those who take their charter to protect and defend seriously.]
Yes, there are a few cops who actually acknowledge the rights of others. I've run into those, too. They looked at my knife and said, "You don't plan on pulling that on anyone, do you?" I say, "No sir," and they don't make an issue of it. -
[It takes all kinds to make a world...and all kinds end up in our police departments.]
To paraphrase my brother: It doesn't take all kinds, we just have all kinds.
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F) In my country (at the risk of sounding like Fez) police brutality naturally follows from the following scenario:
Problem teen gets busted with drugs. Problem teen drops out of school. Problem teen doesn't finish school and can only go to work for the nanny state. Problem teen becomes a cop, because you don't need high school to become a cop or a preacher. Becoming a preacher requires 6 years at university (if you want to become a real one, and even then you don't need to finish high school to get in). Becoming a cop takes 6 months of gun training. What is cooler, guns or books in Hebrew and Greek? Well, if you're a problem teen with a history of drug abuse, then definitely guns. -
A, C, and D.
Like Voodoo, and like SV I have seen far too much brutality and abuse of power used by the police. I get upset when people say "oh, it's only a few" because depending on where you are, and who you are, it's not "just a few bad apples" and the "good apples" don't step up and make the "bad apples" stop what they are doing. Not even when the abusive officers are brought up on charges do the "good cops" speak out against their "brother in blue".
That makes them just as bad if not worse, in my eyes. That empowers the abusive ones - and makes the force a dangerous place to be anywhere near.
Furthermore, I've found that many of the cops here don't even know the laws they're upholding. They don't understand the laws, and often have to go and look things up when asked or cornered about why someone is being arrested/harassed etc...half the time they realize that the person wasn't actually breaking a law, and lets them go - the other half of the time they make something up, and continue to beat the person.
And when you, the citizen, calls in and asks to file a report, or asks for help, or requests an officer you get the runaround, ignored, or otherwise blown off.
I have no use for the police force. -
Most cops I've dealt with have been cool -- even the ones who arrested me during my wilder days. But I can see how cops in high crime rate cities could get a little out of control. When you're dealing with people who have no respect for the law or for other people, you might want to just take matters into your own hands.
There's also the fear factor. When you're dealing with large crowds, such as protests and demonstrations, it's probably easy to get overwhelmed and over react. Usually it's just a few instigators in the crowd who spook the cops and make it bad for everyone else. The cops should be trained better to deal with those situations. -
I would choose the answer D. Maybe in some way, i would like to have control of certain aspect of my life -
In general the role of police has been to keep order, more so than to garauntee Rule of Law. This more noble task is generally left to the courts to sort out. Unfortunatly for those who are tazed to death in the subway, this is too late.
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I have mixed feelings about the police. On one hand, they try to keep the streets safe for the average law abiding citizen.
On the other hand, Chicago has a long history of police abusing their power through beatings, marathon interrogations, racial profiling, bribery.
Two police officers are currently under investigation for brutally beating civilians. One of the victims was a female bartender whose assault was captured on security camera.-
Abuse of power cannot be tollerated in a free society. Unfortunately these things are tolerated and protected until something like this happens where there is evidence.
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In the light of the recent riot that took place in Montreal, between the cops and the participants in a protest against police brutality, I'd say that one the things that causes police brutality are protest against police brutality.
At least here. In fact, it's slowly becoming a tradition.-
I'd say that one the things that causes police brutality are protest against police brutality.
So the brutality didn't occur until people protested the (nonexistent) brutality? -
"So the brutality didn't occur until people protested the (nonexistent) brutality?"
OMG, no, that's not what i meant at all. There IS police brutality, here, just like everywhere else.
Cops are humans, and there are all sorts of cops. Good cops, who genuinely want to provide safety, and power-tripping a-holes who get off on "representing authority".
What i was pointing at, is that the problem is these protests themselves, or rather, their nature.
Some participants join in TO provoke the cops, get a fight going, and then point at them and say: "See? Police brutality, right there!" and play the victim.
This year, I heard the rioters threw vegetables and stones at the cops. This isn't the right way to do this.
I fully support the protesters' right to express their discontentment, but doing it with violence is like the pot calling the kettle black.
A peaceful sit-in, or even a march, where dialogue could take place between the police and the victims of police brutality is something that would make sense to me.
These yearly riots only make the problem worse by increasing the level of tension between both parties. -
OK - I was thinking that you hadn't said what you meant to say Thanks for clarifying.
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No problem!
i was trying to make of my trademark-ish "dripping with sarcasm" posts, but that one did fall flat, lol! -
@salomey: re--"This year, I heard the rioters threw vegetables and stones at the cops. This isn't the right way to do this."
I'd agree, vegetables and stones are a poor offence against riot gear. I'd recommend garden tools for The People to exert THEIR authority. Shovels seem particularly apropriat for shoveling manure for the tree of liberty. -
I was only stating what I heard on the news.
I see your sarcasm but won't raise you anything simply because I just can't be asked.
But it's not about WHAT was thrown, but about throwing stuff in the first place. It's about denouncing violence with violence, and it's just not working. -
one might argue that it is denouncing arbitrary power by means of legitimate power. But yes a bit tongue in cheek there, with reference to a quote by one of our esteemed founding fathers
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"The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it to be always kept alive. It will often be exercised when wrong, but better so than not to be exercised at all. I like a little rebellion now and then. It is like a storm in the Atmosphere."-- Thomas Jefferson
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."--Ibid.
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None of the above and all the above and.....
Brutality of any kind and more particularly mob brutality is part of the pack animal instinct.
In a volatile situation, adrenalin flows and things kick off first with one and then the pack follow. You will see pack behaviour in any riot situation whether it be street or football etc.
Also as with every job, there will be idiots on the payroll who sign up so they can be brutal and have power. -
None of the above, they tend to do this because of bully. Just like tougher and buffier kids do in school, they bully those little ones.. -
D they were bullied as kids so they get a bit of power and thrieve off it, i hate them, theres alot of bad police. badly trained too. ive been involved enough to know.
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