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What is your opinion on being "politically correct"?
Posted by poisonapplesauce • 10/05/08 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: PC
Curious to see the views on this. Do you think it has made society intolerable or more tolerable? Does you think it's like walking on egg shells or common curtosy?
User Comments
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A rose by any other name.
It limits freedom of speech, so it can't be good. All it did was give society more polite or encoded slurs. Definitely walking on eggs. -
I'd say it was ninty percent a good thing. But there is still the odd example when you have to think, Wow, who came up with that idea. -
I think it creates opportunities to bring down people who have strong beliefs in any direction. Political Correctness is about political control and lukewarmness. -
Political correctness (adjectivally, politically correct; both forms commonly abbreviated to PC) is a term applied to language, ideas, policies, or behavior seen as seeking to minimize offense to gender, racial, cultural, disabled, aged or other identity groups. Conversely, the term "politically incorrect" is used to refer to language or ideas that may cause offense.
IMO the underlying intent was and remains a good one. Given our Constitutions and Bills of Rights in democracies, it's my position that it's high time for citizens in multicultural nations to recognize the hypocrisy of using discriminatory language and behaviors and the damage done to our social fabric and to stop it.
However, in the 1990s, because of the term's association with radical politics and communist censorship, it was used by the political right in America to try to discredit the left wing. Now the term itself and its usage are controversial because the term "political correctness" is used almost exclusively in a pejorative sense.
I am looking forward to a time when our countries will actualize the equality that's promised in our Constitutions and Bills of Rights. I don't have a problem with political correctness in the non-pejorative sense. What I have a problem with is those people who are double minded. One on hand, they say they uphold the Constitution and Bill of Rights. On the other they determined to keep discrimination alive in language and behaviors in public spaces and places, while huddling under the banner of freedom of speech. -
The thing that always strikes me about the things we consider "politically incorrect" is that they never seem to bother the people we're supposedly offending. It's always some middle-class white college professor who takes offense.
I think careless use of language can definitely help build unconscious stereotypes and is something that each of us should be conscious of in a way that has nothing to do with political correctness--but I just never hear a person of Asian descent jumping up to hold forth on the critical differences between "oriental food" and "asian food"...that's always some affected kid from suburbia rebelling against the "establishment" on his parents' dime. -
PC-ness, which started out as not soo bad, (but still beyond unnecessary) has become a sham.
The "Victim mentality" now reigns supreme.
I'd prefer we just went back to calling a spade - a spade, as I've really grown tired of trying to guess what the victo-crats of the widely varying PC's want to be called this week. It's just become more fuel for the Sharpton/Jackson weekly marches. And PC-ness (especially in their case,) only swings one way.
They don't seem to have as big a PC problem in golf, as it's STILL called a handicapp. NOT "Stroke Challenged!"-
"I'd prefer we just went back to calling a spade - a spade"
I'm sorry--this age-old saying will have to be revised, as the word "spade" now has negative racial connotation. Kindly begin calling a hoe a...well, no...that might be taken wrong. Call a pitchfork a....oh, that could have religious connotations. I think we're going to have to go with "table saw". Call a table saw a table saw. -
Kindly begin calling a hoe a...well, no...
That's so funny.
I've been called all kinds of weird things. If the shoe fits, it doesn't bother me. If the shoe doesn't fit, it doesn't bother me either. -
I'm sorry--this age-old saying will have to be revised, as the word "spade" now has negative racial connotation. Kindly begin calling a hoe a...well, no...that might be taken wrong. Call a pitchfork a....oh, that could have religious connotations. I think we're going to have to go with "table saw". Call a table saw a table saw.
@MadameX I can relate to your response...
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I think being "PC" inhibits many important conversations that must be going on today. Let's face it, the world is not nice and neither are people. To hold certain conversations hostage in the name of political correctness is absolutely wrong (such as racial profiling). It does not matter whether you agree with racial profiling or not, the problem is that political correctness prevents many people from discussing this topic for fear of "offending" someone. The fact is that someone will always be offended by something you say. Now I am not saying that people go off and use the "N" word or any language like that, I am talking about serious political discussion such as the racial profiling example. Additionally, one of the other commentators hit the nail right on the head, political correctness does not solve racism or any behavior like that. PC language just says the same racist comments just in a more subtle manner, which is just as wrong. Being politically correct just covers up racism and similar behavior, it does not solve it. Political correctness in my opinion causes more problems than it claims to solve. -
All very good points. MadamX nailed what I was getting at with "they never seem to bother the people we're supposedly offending" and I agree with flamingpoodle in that it is walking on egg shells for me, I actually once was yelled at for being "politically" correct. You never know what to say or what not say, discussion and healthy dialog is stifled due to the ever growing amount of "acceptable terms" and no body sending out the updated memo to us.
The reason I started this discussion was because earlier today there was a "homosexual African American" couple at Turkey Hill. This elderly caucasion lady, menaning no offense at all, said to them "Good for you showing pride for both your African American heritage (they had NAACP shirts )and for your sexuality, it's refreshing to see young people happily living their lives". The tallest man then snapped at her "I ain;t from Africa, I'm American *****" and I just looked at him.
In my area, for someone of that age to be so open is a rarity, and she really tried to be PC about it, but it was still considered offensive. On the way home, I started thinking that politcal correctness was more of a detriment than a benefit. Instead of promoting understanding and equality as TT stated it was intended to, the bondage that it places on discussion instead breeds more intolerance. If I can't talk to you with out offending you, I am not going to talk to you. I am not going to ask you about this or that, I am not going to learn. If you are caught up on how I word something, than in my opinion, you are not looking to educate, you are looking to start trouble.
So ends my two sense of the day-
I usually get into a tussle because I focus on what people say and not how they word it. Most people tend to focus on how you word things and not on what you are saying.
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Poisonapplesauce,
Wow, that's an interesting experience you witnessed. I, like you, commend the woman for not only being so open-minded, but for having the gumption to express her support to them. Having it taken the wrong way (or really not even listening to her message but merely her words) saddens me because those are the types of experiences that keep people quiet.
I've been struggling with this whole PC thing a lot in my own community, mainly because political correctness also has to do with what any given individual considers acceptable within the limits of their own personal opinions, etc. For example, it seems to be an unspoken rule where I live that the only politically "correct" statements are conservative ones. It is quite stifling because I am unable to share my thoughts freely, although I have begun to make it known that just because I am in this town in no way, shape, or form should one assume I am associated with the Republican party.
I am seriously considering wearing a black sheep costume for Halloween. -
I thought they liked taking it the wrong way?
OK, I'll shut up now.
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"You never know what to say or what not say".
This does not apply to me as I say whatever the hell I want
and then THEY can "remove the comment" after if they want but I already said what I wanted.-
as always, my hero
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It just gives the whiners something to whine about.
People have to be re-programed in their ways.
Some ways are harmful, some are harmless, but still a whining society are forcing people to be untruthful to themselves. -
There's nothing wrong with being polite. Certain words & phrases have a lot of history and baggage so why say them if they just end up hurting someone.
What's the big deal with being kind to people? Choosing your words carefully doesn't limit freedom of speech, lol ... that's absurd. It's just a nice thing to do, and the mature thing to do.-
Choosing your words carefully and being politically correct are also not the same thing.
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I started to say the exact same thing but gave up
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I was not accustomed to using racial slurs or making bigoted remarks, etc. so I haven't been affected by the change much at all. The only people I hear whining now are those who were not so accustomed.
We can use any language we want and affect any behaviors we want in private places and spaces so what's the problem? If we cross the defamation line and commit slander or libel in our blogs or elsewhere we are risking being sued and IMO that's the way it ought to be. -
TT I think it is more the extremes og how far its gone, there really aren't bigot terms for some of this stuff.
alive...................temporarily metabolically abled
bisexual................sexually non-preferential
chairman................chairperson
crazy...................emotionally distrubed
dominant................opressive
midget..................little person
drug addict.............chemically challenged
and the list goes on. If you were to do an interview on being a bisexual midget junkie for a play, you would have to say " a chemically challenged, sexually non-preferential little person" in order to not offend the three groups above. That is just an example, I think PC passes race and gets into every little adjective in the english language. That is where my problem lies. How much is to much? A three word sentence becomes a paragraph after it's PC'ified lol -
@poisonapplesauce
Are the "extremes" you mention compelled by law?
Are they a requirement of your employment?
If they are a legal requirement then suck it up.
If they are an employment requirement and you don't like that then get another job.
And if they are not either a legal or an employment requirement then why fret about them? -
If you are chemically challenged, dignity is not going to help. You deserve help.
I stumped my English teacher when she did a lecture on the inherent sexism in the English language and how we shouldn't talk about a 'male nurse' or a 'female judge'. I asked her what we should call a male midwife? -
TT you always sound testy I am used to that, it was a discussion generator. Maybe your country is different than mine by what is acceptable and what is not. In looking at almost all of the other responses it is clear that this issue is alive and well and does not constitute as bellyaching . Perhaps the cultural differences render you unaffected by those who do experience this, Canada does have a tad more unity after all, and therefore your news may not be jammed pack of frivilous lawsuits, pointless firings, and so on. If that is indeed that is the issue then that may be why you write it off as belly aching. Also it may be that I am an extrovert and therefore chat up people anywhere ( I literally had a conversation with a medical student while they were prepping me to give birth) and so I come across the issue more? Whatever the case, each region has its own internal struggles, I was curious to see if anyone else had experience with it, they had, so perhaps this is a US issue.
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"I was not accustomed to using racial slurs or making bigoted remarks, etc. so I haven't been affected by the change much at all."
Does anyone know whether "pompous ass" is considered politically incorrect now? -
Does anyone know whether "pompous ass" is considered politically incorrect now?
I'm not clear on how your question fits in to the original intent of political correctness.
Political correctness (adjectivally, politically correct; both forms commonly abbreviated to PC) is a term applied to language, ideas, policies, or behavior seen as seeking to minimize offense to gender, racial, cultural, disabled, aged or other identity groups. Conversely, the term "politically incorrect" is used to refer to language or ideas that may cause offense. -
I see nothing pompous about timethief's comment, nor did it deserve to be deemed as such.
I happen to agree with timethief's other comments regarding the hypocrisy behind our so-called "freedom of speech", our constitution, etc. -
@MarkPogue
If you feel Madame X's comment was a sleazy attempt to make a mean spirited personal attack against me by phrasing her comment as a question, then please feel free to report it.
BTW poisonapplesauce and I are ♥ BC friends ♥ and neither of us chooses to be offended by what the other says. We are quite capable of maintaining goodwill between us even when we disagree. That's why I left the thread graciously by wishing her and everyone else well. -
TimeThief, since this seems to be an area of continual confusion for you, let me point out once again that it is in no way necessary for one to "take offense" in order to recognize that another person's character is in some way lacking. John Wayne Gacy, for instance, killed many young boys in my state. I didn't "take offense" at that--it had nothing to do with me. Nonetheless, I am able to make the objective determination that John Wayne Gacy is not the kind of person that belongs in civilized society, and certainly no one I would want anything to do with. He doesn't affect my day or my life, but that doesn't impair my ability to recognize him for the evil, vile aberration that he is.
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MadameX, I take offence to that. John Wayne Gacy did NOT 'kill boys'. He caused permanent metabolic disability in chronologically challenged persons of the male persuasion.
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FlamingPoodle, this happened in the seventies. I'm not SURE, but I think that we could still say "kill" then. I think.
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TimeThief, since this seems to be an area of continual confusion for you
Ummm ... your presumption that I am confused and that you have a special role when it comes to correcting me with regard to areas that you deem that I am confused about is hilarious, Madame High and Mighty. I'm riddled with hypocrisies and self-contradictions too, just like all other delusional human beings are, yourself included. lol
P.S. I had to look up who John Wayne Gacy was. -
Well, there are lots of little words that are naughty naughty now but weren't in the past. That's kind of the point of being PC.
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No worries, TT. I knew that you weren't confused at all, but were being intentionally disingenuous. I was just being politically correct.
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Well, I see my comment made quite an impact, lol.
I stand by what I said. I'm not talking about the extremes.
And I also agree with what TimeThief said about not being accustomed to using racial slurs, etc. I don't talk that way so I don't feel like I'm being confined in my language when I speak.
I think the only people who are riled up about political correctness are people who are nasty when they talk. They should simply use some intellect and common sense and chose words that are appropriate. There's nothing wrong with that. Maybe it's just challenging for people with a limited vocabulary or maybe they're just too lazy or angry to use something less charged.
Anyway, as my IQ test showed here in a different thread ... I'm a "word warrior" LOL ... so I obviously don't find it difficult to use my brain and use words that aren't charged with a history of violence or racism, etc. -
"I think the only people who are riled up about political correctness are people who are nasty when they talk."
So, Drowsey, you think the woman who inspired this thread by congratulating someone on being proud of his African American heritage was being nasty? You think Kat was being nasty when she accurately used the phrase "mentally retarded" to describe the population she works with? -
Oh for pity sake. AHAHAHA!
Yeah, that's what I'm saying (rolls eyes).
I don't plan to click in here again because obviously you're just interested in arguing.
Go for it. -
So far Madame X is the only person in this thread who has been deliberately mean spirited. She pulled off her seemingly clever attack by posing an personal insult as a question and now she has said:
I knew that you weren't confused at all, but were being intentionally disingenuous. I was just being politically correct.
I was not being "intentionally disingenuous". -
@MadameX I was actually kind of curious about that myself.
@ TT & DM- I think the issue that she is trying to get across is that the topic is words, and in both of your statements, weather intentional or not, it was implied that whoever feels X must be a bigot. When in fact that is not the case at all, perhaps the intentions behind the two original opinions were not what they appeared to be, which was an insult
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I did a parody on PC once.
necrofiles.blogspot.com/2008/04/completely-inappropriate-synopses-of.html
Warning: not for sensitive readers. If you are like me and you don't have a sense of humour at all, you might like it.-
I'm not clicking because I have heard at least 5 years of parodies and bellyaching about this subject, which always brings out forum posters proffering extreme examples, no matter which forum I see it posted on. Unfortunately, those who post rarely acknowledge the original intent and the benefits that have eschewed to those who were previously continuously insulted, offended and demoralized by the use of inappropriate labels and behaviors. This is not to mention the hypocrisy that has prevailed for 200 years, given the contents and spirit of the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
I think that my sentiments are pretty well described in my original post. I am experiencing no pressure or distress of any kind whatsoever due being polite and courteous to others in my working or personal life. And, frankly, I view this as a non-issue that's an emotional pot stirrer and time waster, so I'll love you and leave you.
Best wishes -
Aw, come on. That took me like a whole 5 minutes to write.
You're right, as a private entity I don't feel any political or social pressure to be PC. The old rule of 'if you can't be nice, be quiet' just works.
The situation is much different in the corporate environment. You no longer hand out job descriptions, you have to hand out human dignity too. That's a bit silly in my view. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. You don't renovate just because you can't stand the heat. Especially if it's not your kitchen to begin with. -
@flamingpoodle
You talked me into reading it and it's up to your usual standards ie. it's a good post. lol
Have you read this? IMO it's more about steroetyping than it is about political correctness.
Ten Politically Incorrect Truths About Human Nature
Why most suicide bombers are Muslim, beautiful people have more daughters, humans are naturally polygamous, sexual harassment isn't sexist, and blonds are more attractive. www.psychologytoday.com/articles/pto-20070622-000002.xml -
That's great, thanks. I'll take any kind of absolution for preferring beautiful women to aesthetically challenged women I can find.
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lol
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This political correctness has even filtered into my job title, when I graduated with my Bachelors of Science in Education my teacher certification area was Mentally Retarded, not long after that pressure was put on the state to change the certification to Mentally Impaired, when that wasn't PC enough it was changed once again to Cognitively Impaired, but you know what... it all means the same IQ below 70 and you are mentally retarded, mentally impaired and cognitively impaired. It's just them trying to normalize the defect, guess what... it's not normal that's why it's called Special Education because your child has special needs.
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that was the best example of what I was getting at.
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I've noticed that too, and have noticed a parallel change in how parents refer to their kids. My problem is not so much with the change of words, but with words like "defect," "normal," and "typical." I don't have a child with an IQ below 70, and maybe that is considered a "defect," so perhaps I don't know what I'm talking about. But I have no problem with calling my child a "special needs kid" or anything of the like. I guess a lot of us parents are starting to see our kids as special in a good way, not special in a negative way, if that makes sense. But I don't think of my child as abnormal, just different.
That's a tough one, and I see your point, somewhat. -
Another example is shell shock. It used to be called shell shock, then battle fatigue, then operational exhaustion, then Post-traumatic stress disorder. Now apparently it is combat stress or something.
Being PC is just doublespeak in my view.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublespeak -
I see what you are saying, I don't refer to my students as abnormal, but in the sense of the definition I guess you could say they are. Special needs is not negative in my thinking, actually I taught gen ed one year out of my career and hated it, it was much more interesting and challenging to me to teach to a classroom of special needs kids. I tell my kids all the time to accept their disability, strive to learn new skills and not to let their disablity be an excuse for not succeeding in life.
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thanks Posion
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I agree, Kat. My point was that I think there's even a change afoot from the parents' perspective. Perhaps that's just "acceptance" of what is, but I feel a shift in how parents are thinking about their own SNKs as well as the schools.
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@ whatweneed
I think that can be a good thing, I work with so many parents who just either in denial or simply are reluctant to accept a disability in their child, depending on the deficit it can be the end of the dream for their child, but then again I have parents who are clamoring to get their child labeled for financial gain, (medicade) or just to be one of those kids parents ...anyway it takes all kinds, and I'd rather have to deal with disappointing a parent whose kid does not have a disablity than to deal with a parent of a kid who clearly is disabled and theparent refuses help for their failing child. Ugh I digress -
Actually, "cognitively impaired" does not necessarily mean an IQ of 70 or below, and the need for Special Ed is not limited to children with double digit IQs. My youngest child required Special Ed and he's a member of Mensa.
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I guess it depends whether you believe language follows behavior or behavior follows language. A linguistics prof I had in college firmly believed that if we changed the language, the behavior would change. I don't know if I completely agree with that, but I see the potential.
I do see the power of words, and the power of words to hurt. All I know is if somebody called my son with autism a "retard," I would probably go ballistic. Yet I also see that it's hard to keep up with what is currently considered "PC." Since the last thing I EVER want to do is offend someone, I try to watch my language.-
Well sometimes offending people is inevidable, someone calls your son a retard, thats an opportunity to educate them on what autism really is, sometimes we need to teach people in order for them to become aware and then have an understanding that their thinking is not based on fact but rather flawed, if you offend them by telling them facts that is their problem that they can't see beyond the intention of correction
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ITA with that. I do view my child as giving ME a chance to educate the world about him and about autism in general. People have such a stereotype of "Rainman" in their heads (which actually fits my child on some days, quite frankly), and don't think beyond it. Or they think because he is verbal, he can't have autism. So yes, I am constantly doing that. Although if someone called him a "retard," I guess I'm not sure there's much opportunity for educating that person - I suppose I'd consider them a lost cause!
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The point is not to be politically correct, the point is to not be ignorant or to have those narrow views that do cause offense. Say whatever the hell you want just dont succumb to the narrow views of ignorance, bigotry, racism, discrimination, or stereotypes. When you get that narrow mentality, then you need a crash course in waking the hell up.
buzz buzz-
@thefly
I think you hit the nail on the head. -
@thefly....I gonna have to agree with you, I don't think it has anything to do with being politically correct or politically incorrect, it's more about respecting the person or group of persons you're talking to or about. If you start out from a place of respect I don't think you'll have as many problems as some here are mentioning.
On the flip side of that I do think so people are on the hunt to be offended. If you're looking for it, believe me you don't have to go that far to find it.
But honestly how much is it costing you to be nice?
@poisonapplesauce....not sure what the issue was with the couple from your story but some people are looking for ways to take offense, it's part of their chemical makeup.
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"politically correct/incorrect" are terms used to describe the use of sensitive, unhurtful language in a way that dismisses the phraseology as elitist-speak, not joe-sixpack-speak, and thus diminish the importance of genuine, civil intentions. for example, to announce that i'm about to use politically correct/incorrect terms, is tantamount to declaring, i'm about to speak like/unlike a liberal. this is a very effective way to masquerade the possible bigoted, racist, sexist, etc. nature of what is about to be stated.
as such, these are the word tools of others. i can't really worry about it. -
Dear God, do not ever let anyone call me that!
To say anything we do must be a certain way removes individuality and freedom.
Politically - this word alone is not correct. No one should be political - they should be truthful.
A definition of the word politics is: "social relations involving intrigue to gain authority or power"
That says it all. To add the word correct - is ludicrous and affront to anyone who is honest.
Love the opinions here - we sing like a choir - in harmony with freedom.
I would have to say if anything is correct that would be. -
I think it goes too far, like many things, when you have to start renaming sport teams and removing American Icons like the rebel flag.-
WOW! I'm beginning to appreciate that elsewhere things seem to have gone much, much further than I was aware of.
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Don't get me wrong, I don't own a rebel flag nor will I ever but I think people have a right to celebrate being southern. In Florida the sports teams and local holidays seem to always be under fire from some group that claims to be offended.
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Icons?? You're griping about the removal of the Rebel flag...which symbolizes a fight for slavery in our history?
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Which was When? Is this still relevant? Should we ban the "Dukes of Hazard"? How far do we want to take this?
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Well, see, this is where things get a little fuzzy. The abolition of slavery was the obvious big change that came out of the Civil War, but it wasn't the most significant one, nor the one that was the primary motivation for the war. The Civil War put an end to silly notions like that the U.S. was a voluntary association of states, and the rebel flag, while it might be associated in many people's minds with slavery, is a symbol of southern independence and state sovereignty.
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To me the Rebel Flag remains an icon symbolizing the fight to retain slavery. That's probably because I view it through a Canadian filter and because I know that scripture references were used to keep slavery up and running. However, I'm also aware of American patriotism and nationalism. Yet, I know that to give everything for one's country is to worship one's country. In other words, for those who take this position nationalism becomes religion and patriotism turns into idolatry, which is neither moral nor rational.
Even still, we see and hear some Christians proclaiming God is on their side in Iraq, when scripture indicates that believers are meant to be on his side. And when the New Testament teachings attributed to Jesus provide no base upon which true believers can find validation for acts of violence of any kind, even in self defence, let alone war. -
Telling people that they can't celebrate a war that they lost is like telling the guy that you just beat up that he has to put makeup over his shiner.
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Ah, yes... the rebel flag. Celebrating the time when a bunch of states decided that owning black people was more important than remaining part of the United States. Good times, man. Good times.
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Same thing for schools and roads being renamed. People are dropping George Washington from schools because he was not PC. It's getting ridiculous. You can live and let live without becoming...err... pussified for lack of a better word
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No...it's not still relevant. I'm just saying the Rebel flag should not be attached to any federal or state buildings or any materials owned by US/state taxpayers. The same with religious materials.
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I'm just saying the Rebel flag should not be attached to any federal or state buildings or any materials owned by US/state taxpayers. The same with religious materials.
I agree with you and now we are back to the original intent of the founding fathers. They wisely did not choose to create a Christian nation like those in Europe (the Divine Right of Kings).
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My own personal opinion is:
The words "politically correct" have lost the original impact in meaning, from being overused and abused. And are now just words used to shut someone up, to stop growth, and to prevent change.-
@arcticulates
I agree and I think that the way things have evolved is sad. The original intention was a good one. But, in the 1990s, because of the term's association with radical politics and communist censorship, the political right in America to try to discredit the left wing began misusing the term "political correctness". So today, thanks to Republican administrations, who have brought about record high poverty rates and record high military budgets, and an economic collapse, and a corporate bailout, the term itself and its usage are controversial because the term is used almost exclusively in a pejorative sense.
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I wonder if were really so shallow as to worry about what people may think of us,
based on what we say? Who is to judge who is a fool and/or who is truly ignorant?
People's views about you and I can change like the wind.
It may just be a inner perception overlooked till later, only to later change again.
Just when you think you've figured someone out, that person may do the completely opposite
of what you thought they would do changing how you once viewed them.
Do I really care what people think about what I have to say?
That is personal question that should be answered by each individual.
People say things for different reasons and to put that in box and label it is ridiculous.
People may have the right to say what they want but that doesn't mean you have to stand there
and listen to it either.-
@Jeunelle
Just when you think you've figured someone out, that person may do the completely opposite of what you thought or how you once viewed them.
That's what I mean when I say that I believe ALL humans are riddled with hypocrisies and contradictions. We are all suffering from ignorance about our own true nature and about the nature of others. We all have "filters" and we all operate based on our perceptions.
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Timethief I believe we all are but a monkey doesn't always see his own tail.
Over the years I can look back and see where I went wrong and yet there are some things that I did
and said that I still cannot see. Perception is a funny thing. -
Manners are always a must. If we had them, "PC" wouldn't even exist, or be an issue.-
My sentiments exactly.
People sometimes think I'm an old fogey because I put so much store in the simple courtesies, but they are the lubrication that make the wheels of society turn smoothly. Using good manners (and I am not talking about lifting your pinky when you drink tea) shows respect for others and their rights and feelings. And I think a large part of "political incorrectness" has to do with lack of respect for others and the bad manners to say so.
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Sure most of us may want polite social behaviors
but our methods of doing something are our own and they may not always be customary. -
I think the movement was a good idea, but like so many other good ideas, the end result wasn't what was intended. The goal, I think, was for people to really think about choosing the right words they wanted/needed to use to convey their message. What came about, however, was this ridiculous system of communication wherein everyone tip-toes around subjects and other people's feelings for fear of being either labeled or dismissed. As a result, issues related to diversity/inclusion aren't talked about openly and honestly, they're glossed over and/or ignored because people feel the need to play it safe with their language.-
@quog...This is a very good point and I have noticed this here at BC.
Now that everything said is being policed, people are tip toeing around and doing what they feel they have to do in order to get their point across. It's ashame but that is what happens in a social network that's slowly becoming no longer social.
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For me, my main concern is what to teach my children, they are very young and just learning the differences in people. I do not want to teach them to say something, and then they repeat it and get labeled in school. School is a tough enough place for kids,and with the ever changing labels and methods I fear I will not be up to date enough to "properly" explain things to them. For example my hubby/ex hubby whatever he is taught my 3 year old that uncle Kelly was black, but in that area you were not allowed to say that and when he repeated it, Uncle Kelly was fine with it, but his girlfriend went on a tirade about how I should teach him the term African American. From what I have seen and heard today, that term is also now offensive, so what do I tell him? My grandma had a cute little story to explain the differences but I am not sure that even would suffice anymore. Same thing, homosexual is now an offensive term as well, so how do I explain? I want him to be open to everyone, the ever changing list of faux paus just make it really hard to break down to a child when you have to re-explain it almost monthly
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Honestly, I just don't even really bother "explaining" all that.
I just tell Punky - that's so and so, so and so knows us because of___ and so and so is very nice. If so and so happens to be a different race, religion, or sexual orientation...who cares?
I would only correct Punky if some kind of derogatory term came flying out - and i mean something rude, and intended to insult. -
very sound advice, I think I will follow that suit. it only came up one because he asked if god burned him (he is under the impression god cooks people for some reason).
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I think there is a natural curiosity about difference in race, and gender specifically that children have. In that case, it's perfectly acceptable to explain the difference using science - to whatever age appropriate level.
Telling a child that someone with darker skin has more melotonin (sp?) than those with lighter skin as the reason is best. It is, after all, the truth.
In our house, unless we speak in generalities about "groups" specifics are just not brought up. There's no reason to single it out. -
Melanin.
I envy people with abundant melanin. They don't sunburn like melanin-deficient me. (My husband's ethnic heritage is southern Indian and when he starts driving his car with the top down, he browns up beautifully. I keep a tube of 100 SPF in the glove box...not enough melanin
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Thanks SV Melotonin is a brain chemical, isn't it...
Ugh I should NOT post when I'm tired
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Here we go round in circles....
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We spend too much time worrying about it. Politically correctness is nothing more than adherence to the misguided belief that people have an innate right to go through life unoffended by anything.-
Which I normally would agree with you, but we should consider the rights of minorities also.
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Offending someone is not a crime and it shouldn't be one. I have the right to be offended. It's good for me, because it broadens my horizons.
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@Mark I going to have to disagree. A minority has a right to not be harassed verbally and physically, they do not have a right to go through their life an not be offended by the way others say or do. They have a right to say I do not like x,y, and z don't think people should be engaging in those behaviors. They do not however have any right constitutional or otherwise to demand that society force these people to change. Why because the pendulum swings both ways.
For example: If you are offended by those showing off too much skin you have a right to complain about it, but you do not have a right to demand that those people cover up more than they are legally obligated to do, simply because it offends you. If you had that right, then by all right so does the other person, who could claim that you offended them and god by covering up what god gave you and should therefor be required to take it off.
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I think it's gone too far, especially in schools. Remember Christmas Vacation? Now it's Winter Break. Easter Vacation is Spring Break. No more Halloween class party, it's a Fall Party. If I want to call it a Christmas Tree I'm going to call it a Christmas Tree!-
@ tonymas
Should it be called "Christmas vacation" in a public school where not only Christian children attend, but also Muslim, Jewish or Pagan children???
Our country is becoming more diverse whether we like it or not.
ALL of us may have to share a seat on this train. -
If the majority of the kids attending are from Christian homes, then it should be called Christmas vacation. Why should that be offensive? I don't get offended if a Muslim person tells me he's celebrating Ramadaan. I'm not even Christian, but I don't feel offended when someone tells me that they're going to enact in ceremonies with their imaginary friends.
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I call it a christmas tree too, just like I call a menorah a menorah
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Respect each other's differences, cultures, religions etc etc. Political correctness is good to a point but like anything it can get silly, we are humans with flaws after all. -
The intent of PC'ness is good in moderation. It's about manners and caring about people. At times, it does get out of hand though.-
The intent of Joseph Stalin was also good.
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political correctness is censorship and endangers free speech by limiting what is considered acceptable public discourse, especially in university and the political forums. -
Here's more fun:
The top ten most politically incorrect phrases.
www.impactlab.com/2005/11/18/top-ten-most-politically-correct-terms/ -
I have rarely felt the need to be politically correct or walk on eggshells. One can express an idea or opinion without being rude or inconsiderate, unfortunately it seems some think they can and then claim pc or limits on free speech is to blame when they are called on it. -
These days it feels like (1) a term used to put down people who have manners or (2) an excuse to be rude. -
I've always hated the term, though the basic idea of respecting other people rather than insulting them because of their race, gender, orientation etc. is certainly a good one, and I find it incredibly ironic that self-styled Christians who claim to believe in the golden rule and worship someone who exhorted them to love their neighbor, have such a problem with being called on their hateful behavior.
The worst thing about it, though, is that it's given bigots a way to feel like rebels--nowadays, if you call somebody on making an idiotic, hateful remark, chances are the person will respond with "oh, sorry I'm not being politically correct...." One of my early blog posts was about this:
yogaforcynics.blogspot.com/2008/06/hatred-by-any-other-namesmells.html -
I have to say, I've always been slightly more offended by "PC" than "honesty". Like calling me African American. Well, I'm not from Africa and I'm of mixed heritage, so I'd much rather be called (by my name) or Black. If someone isn't sure, they can do what I do...ASK. I'm not a check box at the end of an app,I'm a person. Political correctedness came from society trying to regulate the tongues of people who are so severely ignorant that they require guidelines. If you think politics need to correct you, then you've already said too much.-
I'm not a check box at the end of an app, I'm a person.
Exactly. Which is why I'm not offended by racial slurs. Some of the characteristics would apply, some of them won't, but I'm an individual and I would prefer not to deal with people who want to deal with me for what I'm supposed to be in their minds instead of what or who I am. -
Thank you, that is the what I was getting at, those exact same phrases. Many people here assume I am talking about the n-word or something when I brought this up and in fact my main example was how the term African-American was offensive to many now even though that's the phrase being pushed and that PC has the reverse affect.
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I am offended by racial slurs. This goes back to being a society that needs to be governed. Can we act responsibly without such strict social guidelines? I don't run around calling every Asian I meet, Asian-American, because they might be from one of many Asian or Pacific Island backgrounds. But I'm not going to call them a racial slur. If people can't find the happy medium without being told what to do, then that explains why we have such idiot-proof suggestions.
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Oh absolutely. That makes sense. I have been yelled at for saying black and African American and that is where my confusion set in. I have never been one for slurs as it goes against religion. Closest I come is calling my brother wonderbread. I appreciate the clarification as to why the term African American was offensive in the case of the initial story. Now I know, and knowing is half the battle
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I was called European. Hello, I was born in Africa. I'm from Africa. I haven't been outside of Africa. I speak 3 African languages. My ancestors have been from Africa for more than 300 years. There is nothing European about me. Just call me white or Caucasoid if you must.
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Sorry if this has already been said but in the UK there is far too much PC bureaucracy and it does get in the way of common sense more often than not. they should be guidelines, for a communication 'toolbox' and not as hard and fast rules.
A classic example is of Schools banning the use of the word 'Brainstorm' in planning meetings as it offends people suffering from Epilepsy - even though with two clicks of a google search they could find the answer on the official UK Epilepsy website (National Society for Epilepsy (NSE)) stating that it is not an offensive term; and that to NOT use the term Brainstorm on those grounds is inadvertently causing offense to them! In short rather than just ask them, they 'assume' and then forcibly make an ass out of u and me by offending them...
I think life is confusing enough without being told to do something that contravenes good sense - that is we should be able to ask someone what they prefer and then we should ask other people if they also prefer that same choice or what particular terms of reference they prefer.
I often err against PC guidelines in most cases, but I am quick to correct my actions if I learn that I have unintentionally caused offence. -
I think that being politically correct has damaged out country and the world. Being PC just gives people the opportunity to continue to be ignorant!!!!-
totally agreed
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Being politically correct somehow can be abusive. It is most often vague and can be judgmental to people who have strong faith and beliefs on issues and other matters. It's not good and it it does not bring out the best of any thing.-
agreed
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I've always subscribed to the notion that I would rather know who hates me than have to guess who hates me under the guise that they are tolerable. -
Didn't PC used to mean personal computer? -
Here's more pc madness:
www.sideroad.com/Business_Communication/politically-correct-language.html -
To me being "pc" ties into this misguided notion people have of their "constitutional right to never be offended by anything" - but as MadameX points out above - it's never those we think might be offended who end up being the ones offended - it's always someone else who is offended on their behalf!
It's handcuffed us. Nobody says what they feel anymore as they are too worried of offending someone. It's killed something of the geuninity in our discussions.
It has a purpose, don't get me wrong - and I'd much prefer people being "pc" to running around spouting off racially insensitive terms, but it premeates so much more than that now as to find itself inhibiting rather than liberating.-
worse than thinking it is a constitutional right they think it is an inalienable human right.
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its important but it is important not to loose the message behind it as many people just do it because it is hip. im a firm believer that when speaking of prejudice if one is not outraged no matter how pc that person is it is extremely pointless. on anouther note everything is socially constructed so its not real. with that said prejudice is more f-cked up thab anything. america here gets worse as the years pass, im a sceptic -
I steadfastly defend everyone's Constitutional right to be offended.
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