Political Discussions
Conservatives distancing themselves from McCain-Palin
Posted by RuinousRight • 10/14/08 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: 2008, conservative, Economy, election, mccain, obama, pundits, real issues
John McCain has demonstrated poor judgement and erratic behavior in his bid for the White House. The Straight Talk Express seemed to go off track when he flip-flopped on the George Bush tax cuts and then things really started going down hill once people became more familiar with his V.P. pick - Alaskan Governor Sarah Palin.
Throughout the past few months, well-known conservative journalist, pundits, economists and politicians have expressed dissatisfaction with the Republican ticket and some have even gone as far as to endorse Barack Obama.
Why so many... and what are they saying?
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Conservatives Blame McCain
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wbjg9Hh17lI
McCain is 'Erratic in a Crisis'
www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MPd0RIZLkw
Why the rich love McCain
www.ruinousright.com/the_john_mccain_channel.html
User Comments
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In this political and economic climate he simply can't appeal to both his uber conservative base, and everyone else at the same time.
He just can't - and I think his floundering, attacks, and strange behaviors during his campaign has led reasonably minded people wondering if he really knows what he's doing.
Think about this, McCain essentially won the nomination 6 months prior to the RNC that made it official. His opponents conceded and dropped like flies so early on that McCain should have been light years ahead of Obama on the campaign trail.
Setting up offices in key states, raising the money he needed to fund the campaign properly, vetting his VP pick more than 24 hours before the R NC....nailing down the details of his strategies, his policies, his platforms and how the campaign will be run - he should have been so prepared that the economic crisis would have been a blip in his strategy.
But he didn't. I don't know what he was doing during that time, but preparing wasn't it. This, to me, is a big negative towards him in the election. -
From today's Caucus blog at the NYTimes:
Christopher Buckley, son of conservative mainstay William F. Buckley, leaves the National Review after endorsing Obama.
Here's the link:
thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/10/14/buckleys-son-leaves-national-review/ -
Christopher Buckley recently wrote an article on why he is choosing Obama... Then the National Review kicked him out of their magazine. There is a kind of
darkly humorous justice in the world.
blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/10/14/buckley-is-out-at-national-review-after-o...-
Fellow columnist Kathleen Parker last month wrote a harsh critique of McCain’s running mate, Sarah Palin, calling on her to bow out of the race. “If BS were currency, Palin could bail out Wall Street herself,” she wrote.
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Conservative writer Kathleen Parker received email threats after writing Sarah Palin column.
Allow me to introduce myself. I am a traitor and an idiot. Also, my mother should have aborted me and left me in a Dumpster, but since she didn't, I should "off" myself.
Those are just a few nuggets randomly selected from thousands of e-mails written in response to my column suggesting that Sarah Palin is out of her league and should step down.
Speak correctly, or build a big bunker
www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/chi-oped1001parkeroct01,0,3151779.co...
This kind of attack is one of the reasons some Republicans/Conservatives are supporting Barack Obama:
www.republicansforobama.org/
gop4obama.org/
www.palinbycomparison.net/
blogs.usatoday.com/oped/2008/03/a-new-political.html
adisgruntledrepublican.blogspot.com/
www.couchmouse.net/
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Re-titled
The Thinking Conservatives....
As the GOP shrinks itself --- after Christopher Buclkey wrote his piece on endorsing Obama....
"he revealed another surprise: After NR readers raised holy heck over his perceived betrayal of the right, he offered to resign his column – and it was accepted.
“It upset a great number of people – a huge number of canceled subscriptions, apostasy, the whole thing,” he said from Washington.
When he offered his resignation to the magazine’s editors, “I was sort of hoping for, ‘Well, let’s think about it,’ ” Buckley said. “But to paraphrase Ronald Reagan,
"While I regret this development, I am not in mourning, for I no longer have any clear idea what, exactly, the modern conservative movement stands for. Eight years of “conservative” government has brought us a doubled national debt, ruinous expansion of entitlement programs, bridges to nowhere, poster boy Jack Abramoff and an ill-premised, ill-waged war conducted by politicians of breathtaking arrogance. As a sideshow, it brought us a truly obscene attempt at federal intervention in the Terry Schiavo case. "
I didn’t leave the Republican Party, the Republican Party left me.”
I'm sure his father would be proud of him. Thinking men think. The rest takes sides.
www.balloon-juice.com/?p=12387 -
Buckley leaves National Review after Obama endorsement
Christopher Buckley, the son of conservative icon William F. Buckley, said Tuesday he's resigned from the conservative National Review days after endorsing Barack Obama's White House bid, among the most powerful symbols yet of the conservative discontent expressed this election cycle.
The resignation comes four days after Buckley formally endorsed Obama on the Web site The Daily Beast, writing the presidential campaign had made John McCain "inauthentic," and Obama appeared to have a "first-class temperament and first-class intellect."
politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/14/buckley-leaves-national-review-aft...-
our minds are in the same place ruinous - the blue gutter.
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So it seems.
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Maybe it's linked from some of the other pieces, but here are Buckley's own words, first the endorsement and then the witch hunt:
www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2008-10-10/the-conservative-case-fo...
www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2008-10-14/sorry-dad-i-was-fired
Course I don't know if any McCain supporters here actually read the National Review. I never see it cited here, meaning maybe they don't know who Buckley is and don't care.-
It's crazy how venomous the right can be when someone leaves the flock. I'm sure his experience will continue to be similar to conservative writer Kathleen Parker's, who received mounds of hate mail for her comments regarding Sarah Palin. He notes they are already pen pals exchanging vile emails.
I love this comment left by one reader:
It seems that a reasoned conservative point of view is something that we've been missing for such a long time now that those of the right wing population at large have a visceral reaction against reasoning itself. I appreciate anyone who is willing to have a civil dialogue, as those few of my more conservative acquaintances seem able to do. Thank you for elevating the discourse.
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I assumed originally they were at least reading the more substantive and respected conservative journals. I know I read them. Now I am beginning to believe they're just reading the more insane propaganda sites. Given most, not all by any means, of the discussion it doesn't surprise me much. It's pretty funny because most of my liberal friends, and even the people reading my blog, know who the well known known authoritative conservatives are.
Off Topic:
Did you notice the "Jump Ship" list being kept at the Jed Blog?
www.jedreport.com/shipjumpers/-
Nice list.
Did you see Newt Gingrich on Fox (maybe other channels as well) saying we need to get behind the bailout even though it's a hard pill to swallow. Then a couple days later bashing McCain for supporting the bailout?! Too funny. -
the jump ship list is pretty funny. though i must say, if michelle malkin is now against mccain, he may not be ALL bad. just kiddin'!
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Reagan adviser can’t support McCain/Palin
Former Reagan adviser Ken Adelman discusses why he cannot support Sen. McCain and will be voting for Sen. Obama.
ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/21/reagan-adviser-cant-support-mccainpalin/ -
Why McCain Has Lost Our Vote
Being Barry Goldwater's granddaughter and living in Arizona, one would assume that I would be voting for our state's senator, John McCain. I am still struck by certain 'dyed in the wool' Republicans who are on the fence this election, as it seems like a no-brainer to me.
www.huffingtonpost.com/cc-goldwater/why-mccain-has-lost-our-v_b_137150.html-
the goldwater thing is no surprise. barry goldwater couldn't stand mccain.
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Now Scott McClelland has endorsed Obama. (NPR News)
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Yes... just saw that. Here's the CNN article:
Former Bush aide voting for Obama
"From the very beginning I have said I am going to support the candidate that has the best chance for changing the way Washington works and getting things done and I will be voting for Barack Obama and clapping," McClellan told new CNN Host D.L. Hughley
politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/24/former-bush-aide-voting-for-obama-...
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Repub's are distancing themselves from their party's candidates in droves - and this seems like the only way for the Republican Party to redeem itself!
What interesting times we're living in!-
I think they are concerned that McCain/Palin will take the party down with them.
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Et Tu, GOP? The Conservative Betrayal Spectrum
Ever since John McCain picked Sarah Palin as his running mate and his poll numbers soared and then quickly tanked, his team has experienced a set of slow-but-steady defections by some of America's most prominent conservative voices.
nymag.com/daily/intel/2008/10/et_tu_gop_the_conservative_bet.html -
See my web log for a link to a video about McCain's temper!!!
skdd.wordpress.com/2008/10/24/presidential-temperament/#respond -
Former Mass. governor Bill Weld has endorsed Obama. Sure, he's less conservative than some Republicans, but people in battleground NH know him.
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And did you see the Politico article about a circular firing squad? www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14891.html
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Dropping like flies...
Reagan Appointee and (Recent) McCain Adviser Charles Fried Supports Obama
Charles Fried, a professor at Harvard Law School, has long been one of the most important conservative thinkers in the United States. Under President Reagan, he served, with great distinction, as Solicitor General of the United States. Since then, he has been prominently associated with several Republican leaders and candidates, most recently John McCain, for whom he expressed his enthusiastic support in January.
This week, Fried announced that he has voted for Obama-Biden by absentee ballot.
blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/10/24/reagan-appointee-and-r...-
The funny thing is, he's a member of John McCain's Honest and Open Ethics Committee!
www.johnmccain.com/informing/news/PressReleases/90c928f6-38c7-4dc3-86c6-151...
And his his Justice Advisory Committee!
www.johnmccain.com/informing/News/PressReleases/34a065bf-cc56-4c2d-8bf6-229... -
This week, Fried announced that he has voted for Obama-Biden by absentee ballot. In his letter to Trevor Potter, the General Counsel to the McCain-Palin campaign, he asked that his name be removed from the several campaign-related committees on which he serves. In that letter, he said that chief among the reasons for his decision "is the choice of Sarah Palin at a time of deep national crisis."
blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/10/24/reagan-appointee-and-r...
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I can hardly keep up...
Republican Former Mass. Governor Endorses Obama
Former Massachusetts Gov. William Weld, a Republican, endorsed Democrat Barack Obama for president on Friday, citing the senator's steady leadership, good judgment and ability to unify Democrats, Republicans and independents.
"Sen. Obama is a once-in-a-lifetime candidate who will transform our politics and restore America's standing in the world," Weld said in a statement.
elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/24/republican-mass-governor-endorses-obama/
EDIT TO ADD: Mark beat me to it above. -
Charles Krauthammer is often amusing. Here he tells off his Republican colleagues for jumping ship: www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/1008/Krauthammer_brings_the_fastball.....
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Ken Adelman: Why a Staunch Conservative Like Me Endorsed Obama
www.huffingtonpost.com/ken-adelman/why-a-staunch-conservativ_b_137749.html -
In corporations this is called CYA or Cover Your Ass.
In politics, it's called damage control. McCain put on a bad enough show that his fellow Republicans roll their eyes and backtrack from him. If that's not the ultimate insult, I don't know what is. -
Article in Politico about GOP mavericks distancing themselves from the would-be maverick McCain: www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14986.html.
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ODD MAN OUT: Chuck Hagel’s Republican exile.
One of John McCain's closest friends won't even endorse him for POTUS.
www.newyorker.com/reporting/2008/11/03/081103fa_fact_bruck?printable=true -
Former GOP senator, vet backs Obama
Former Sen. Larry Pressler (R-S.D.), who was the first Vietnam veteran to serve in the United States Senate, is the latest Republican to back Sen. Barack Obama's presidential campaign.
"I just got the feeling that Obama will be able to handle this financial crisis better, and I like his financial team of [former Treasury Secretary Robert] Rubin and [former Federal Reserve Chairman Paul] Volcker better," he said. By contrast, John McCain's "handling of the financial crisis made me feel nervous."
The former senator added that he hoped the next president would help place restraints on executive pay, and said: "I don't think [McCain] will take action in that area, or he's as likely to."
Pressler, who said that he had never voted for a Democrat for president before, added, "I feel really badly. I just hate to go against someone I served with in the Senate.
www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14963.html -
Wow - so many people walking away...you know you ran a bad campaign when your own party starts leaving in droves.
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Being the "maverick" that he is, maybe McCain will back Obama. After all, he's running on a platform that he will change the things he helped screw up.
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Now that made laugh so hard I snorted!
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McCain sucked from the beginning
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I'd be interested in hearing how you think the GOP should move forward. You've claimed the GOP lost because it moved more towards the center with McCain, but didn't the majority of Republicans choose McCain? Doesn't that imply that the majority of Republicans wanted to move away from divisive politics and the far right? I've spoken to several conservatives that say the Palin pick drove them to either skip the vote or cast a vote for Obama. Many others now claim she could be the savior of your party.
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I am a conservative and Palin helped solidify my pick. Republicans are not conservatives, if you think so, then you are a fool. Idk what kind of conservatives you talked to, but Palin is about as conservative as it gets. The GOP should move more towards a Reagan type individual and take more power away from itself. Our government is to big.
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Bush has exactly the same ideology as Reagan. The only difference is, Reagan had a democratic congress to limit the amount of damage he could cause. If you want a "real" conservative, you have to go back to the Eisenhower administration.
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And what are you going to say when the world fails to end?
Seriously, you right wing "EVERYONE'S GOING TO FU**ING DIE!!" panicky, wet your pants types have been around since Clinton. Guess what, the world has failed to end. Weird, huh?
Rush Limbaugh is wrong, liberalism isn't death.
It's just a different opinion. Time to grow the f**k up. -
Most conservatives identify with the Republican party and most Republicans call themselves conservatives. Palin is mostly a social conservative who is not especially appealing to the fiscal conservatives. Those I spoke with felt the GOP had moved too far right to appease the evangelicals and their followers. They felt the current administration had charted a destructive course that disregarded the desires of most Americans. Anyone who disagreed with the administration's direction was labeled 'godless', 'unpatriotic' and/or 'anti-American'.
Many Republicans mainly want fiscal responsibility and a smaller government. They want a strong military, but they don't all want the U.S. to police the world. They want their guns, but they seem willing to give up more civil liberties to protect the nation from possible terrorism. They want conservative values, but they don't necessarily want their leaders to invoke 'God's will' when talking about a war that has left so many dead. Some want to get past divisive politics so the government can affectively serve the people.
It seems to me that the GOP will need to make a choice regarding which kind of conservative ideology should lead the party. Should the extreme right ideas and attitudes of Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and Ann Coulter be guiding lights for the party or should it move away from that mentality and in a direction that would be more appealing to mainstream Republicans and Independents. -
Unfortunately some of the actual leaders of the GOP are out of touch. A recent plea went out from a GOP headquarters (I don't know if this was a state or national plea). It called for money to help defend America from the Obama democrats and then went on to call the Obama democrats attack words. While this may rile up a small portion of the "base", IMO more of the moderate republicans and independents get turned off by that attitude. A more better plea would have been to call for strengthening the GOP to ensure a balanced government where GOP core principals are represented. Same thing but without the childish attacks.
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You guys, particularly sati, wisco, and ruinous right know nothing about Conservatism.
"Seriously, you right wing "EVERYONE'S GOING TO FU**ING DIE!!" panicky, wet your pants types have been around since Clinton. Guess what, the world has failed to end. Weird, huh?
Rush Limbaugh is wrong, liberalism isn't death.
It's just a different opinion. Time to grow the f**k up."
Where in the hell did you pull this bull crap up? And your telling me to grow up when you are saying f*ck. Hhahahahahahaaa what irony. Our opinion is different than yours and you assume we think the world is going to explode. WRONG. we just say our lives are going to suck if a liberal gets in office and particularly people like Obama. You guys do the same thing.
Ruinous Right Liberals give up more freedoms by imposing much stronger government. Conservatism is for smaller government. Again you are confusing republicans with conservatives. Republicans put on a hoax to people that they are conservatives, but in fact they are just another dumb big gov liberpublican.
Sati: your statement isn't even worth replying to. People liked Eisenhower because he won WWII. Reagan has created a conservative lifestyle that converted many democrats to the right because it made so much sense.
Xmarks: The GOP sucks!!! I don't care what you think I believe, but I am not a republican. Republicans call themselves conservatives, but I laugh in the face of that. -
we just say our lives are going to suck if a liberal gets in office and particularly people like Obama. You guys do the same thing.
The difference, of course, is that we have eight years of life sucking as evidence. All you've got is wild speculation and absurd claims that Barack Obama -- who hasn't even been sworn in yet -- is responsible for the recession.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that people say you're crazy because you guys act freakin' crazy. "Conservatives," as right wing radical reactionaries have come to call themselves, are completely out of their minds.
Seriously, why do you think the Republican party is on the outs right now? Because the American people are tired of whiny, perpetually outraged lunatics. They've decided to let the grownups drive for a change.
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No the whiny children have taken the wheel and now we have no idea where we are going. When did I ever say that Obama is responsible for the recession? As I recall many Democrats were backing Fannie and Freddie Mac and blaming race for the Republican concerns. Well that turned out to be bad. The Democrats gained control of congress and so far nothing has gotten done. The recession has become full blown under their watch and their government happy ego's. If you think anything is going to get done in these next 4 years, then you are smoking something. You forget that the Republicans didn't have a huge majority in Congress, many of the Republicans have even gone over to the other side in many decisions. It has been a joint failure and the monarch Bush(in liberals eyes) shouldn't take 100% of the blame.
Do you really think anybody like the Democratic Party? The only reason they voted for them is because either they don't like Bush ( which is probably 90% of them) or they want to see what will happen under a Democrat.
Reagan was a conservative and we did well under that period. That is what conservatism is and not the twisted view you have now.-
Reagan tripled the U.S. debt. There's nothing conservative about that.
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Thank you sati for beating me to the punch. Perhaps theboyjlowe is one of the conservatives that refuse to recognize the Reagan deficit. They are out there.
Okay...where to begin?
The first thing to cover is this so called Democratic majority. You need to go back and learn how the system works. You need to go back and count the numbers in the Senate after the 2006 election. Then explain how to use those numbers against veto power. Nuff said. The same excuse has lead people to believe the economy went to crap when the Dems were elected in '06.
Theboyjlowe, if Sarah Palin had that much appeal in your eyes, I'm going to take a shot in the dark and guess you are not only a fiscal conservative, but a social one as well. I already tried to tell you something about social conservatives elsewhere on BC. Maybe that message was never received. There was nothing Reagan-esque about her RNC speech. It was vindictive and played into the new trend that the word "liberal" is a bad one. Limbaugh plays the same hand of cards and if I'm not mistaken, you pepper this sort of rhetoric in your own posts here. You said yourself that conservatives like you think the world is going to suck if a liberal takes over.
If you are in fact one of these social conservatives hiding behind fiscal policies to defend yourself, you need to realize YOU are the kind of conservative dragging down the party and not these "false republican" characters you pulled out of your backside. If that's the case, then perhaps you have the terms republican and conservative confused. Palin is not as conservative as it gets. On social issues, her kind of "conservatism" relies on bigger government dictating social policy. You cannot be in love with Reagan and Palin for the same reasons and still have freedom. Let's not forget that one suffered from senility and the other is a flat out lunatic. It's dementia vs delusion if I'm not mistaken.
As a conservative, you are going to have to make some sacrifices to solidify your party. If you choose to continue on this insane path with similar conservatives, you can kiss your bum goodbye. -
Not even worth reading because its from a liberals point of view
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That's a sad way to go through life.
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... but it's so much simpler to live that way! If you only look at one point of view, you don't have to think!
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This ladies and gents is why I hate closed minded party zealots. The republicans think the libs are commies and the libs find repubs war mongering isolationists.
We really need some better parties. -
Not even worth reading because its from a liberals point of view
That's a sad way to go through life
But necessary to maintain the proper level of ignorance.
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I have seen and heard enough of what you guys say and I have come to the conclusion to just ignore your crap. You have no idea what conservatives are and think in your twisted mind that it is communism. Your confusing your big government lifestyle to my view of smaller government. Palin wants the American people to take more responsibility for themselves and not depend on the government for everything. But I guess that will be considered offensive to people like you. "How dare that people take care of themselves".
Liberalism should be compared to a facist government run state where people have very little opinion and look towards the government for everything. Anything and everything the liberals talk about has to do with government. Liberals believe that people are to ignorant to take care of themselves and your party consists of thousands of loaners who don't want to take care of themselves. They have no idea of what the real world offers and they give massive bailout plans that create only temporary relief. Liberals are more concerned about getting votes and retaining power. Liberals talk a big game about republican spending, but they approved everything the republicans have done. They lead the charge saying that Freddie and Fannie Mac were doing great. Then they blame the republicans for the trouble and take no personal responsibility they have done. Liberals tend to take no responsibility for anything and blame everything on the world around them. Liberals are some of the biggest pansies when it comes to being insulted. They complain about literally everything and consider you an idiot if you don't agree with murdering (aborting babies). They believe that if you don't agree with gay marriage, then you are some kind of horrible "religious" ogre that lets nobody have an opinion on the subject. Obama for example will most likely do nothing that he said in the campaign and will continue on the disgraceful liberal path that we have grown to hate. I feel sorry for you that you even have the state of mind to agree with the disgraceful policies that I have stated and thus why I laugh at most everything you say. -
Oh do I care? I have known enough about you from past conversations and I see no need in engaging in a conversation with you. Get over it. Your name even gives you a bad name.
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Ruinous Right - Republicans/Conservatives who spend most their time spewing divisive rhetoric and misinformation to help fulfill their own selfish agendas (and/or 'the will of God'). Republican politicians who cater to their wealthy and corporate pals while ignoring the Constitution and will of the people.
That said, I do not think all Republicans/Conservatives are ruinous. I have several conservative Republican friends who can engage in intelligent conversation about the real issues and I have come across several more online. I also recognize there are Republican politicians who do not subscribe to some of the ruinous policies of current administration nor the divisive politics coming from the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Michael Savage and Sean Hannity.
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you still have Republicans confused with Conservatives. There is a huge difference and you have yet to figure that out.
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As I said before... Most conservatives identify with the Republican party and most Republicans call themselves conservatives. As well, you champion Sarah Palin who is also a Republican and a social conservative.
How about explaining your definition of a conservative, which party you support and why.
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yes they identify with them because there is no party that has a chance to win other than the Republican. yes we vote Republican, but its because we hate democrats.
A conservative is for smaller government, lower taxes, free capitalist market and strong national security. That is definitely not anything that a Republican stands for. Sarah Palin is for these things btw.-
There's nothing "conservative" about free market economics. We're paying the price right now for all the deregulation that occurred during the past ten or so years. Free market economics is radical economics -- not conservative.
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So.... Republicans do not stand for the things conservatives believe in and you hate Democrats?
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Yes, that is what I just said. You still do not realize that a conservative is not a Republican.
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Again... Most conservatives identify with the Republican party and most Republicans call themselves conservatives. I realize this fact, but you seem to be a conservative who does not identify with the Republican party except you champion Sarah Palin.
Regardless of how you or I view the conservative-Republican relationship, the GOP still needs to regroup and choose a new path forward. This was my original post above, but somehow it got off track with your insistence on focusing on something else.
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Free market economics is not what we have right now. We basically have a socialist- capitalist market where the government has its hand in everything anyway. Free markets are conservative.
Unions have a big problem with the economy. They dictate how many companies operate and they overall are not effective (except for screwing up things). -
Sarah Palin is a Republican but she is a conservative
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And you are everything that is wrong with the Republican party which is why they are in this mess. It has divided the party you voted with into the crazy faction you associate yourself with which includes folks like Limbaugh, Colter, et al, and the others who are real conservatives that don't sit around all day spewing hate. Both are conservative. The latter are for smaller government, lower taxes, capitalism, and *maybe* a strong military. One group tried to distance itself from McCain-Palin and the other hated McCain until Palin was picked. Why? Social issues and the hatred for liberals. Again, I cite Palin's RNC speech and the snarky speeches leading up to hers as evidence.
So it still leaves a question unanswered. There is a power struggle going on within the conservative ranks. If the side spewing hate takes control, you are done for as a party and the obvious solution for the sensible conservatives out there is to create a third party. I have a feeling libertarians are ready to welcome them with open arms. You seem to understand that in order to win, you have to vote with the Republicans. You do realize that with this division, you won't have the numbers to win anything, right? You are going to have to give a little to the Republican party if you want to get anywhere. Being obstinate is only going to dig you guys into a very deep hole. -
I thought she was a maverick.
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And this makes the liberals any less smarter? They will put us into a socialized state in no time. congratulations for electing imbeciles.
If you guys are so concerned about Limbaugh and Coulter, then ya'll are crazy. For one, they hold no power and these people tear liberals to pieces. You then cannot back yourselves up and Limbaugh in particular makes you look like a fool. O it isn't hate speech, it is just logical bashing towards your kind.-
O it isn't hate speech, it is just logical bashing towards your kind.
Noooo, there's no indoctrination by punditry at all....
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The logical bashing has not worked out so well for the conservatives that last couple of elections.
Maybe it is time to try just plain old logic. -
logic has gotten conservatives 20 years of Presidents (even if they aren't true conservatives) and 8 years total for the Dems in the last 28 years.
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I think we will have to differ on Bush's elections being the product of logic.
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You do forget how bad a job President Carter did.
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Carter was over his head and that led to Ronald's win. Back to the question. If logic was so good for the cause, please do more of that than so-called "logical bashing."
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don't defend carter, he sucked, thats all thats to it. The democrats failed miserably as usual.
Logic was good until Republicans became Democrats and strayed away from the conservatives. -
Carter was ineffective as president, but he didn't cause any long lasting damage like Reagan did. Reagan was a radical. He tripled the U.S. debt and his policies led to the S&L scandals and bailouts of the late 80s.
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yes, interesting we never hear about those things sati. Probably because so many people liked him and sense he did such a great job. Clinton did nothing to help the debt either. Was still 3 trillion
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Who's defending Carter?
You probably haven't heard much about those things because of your age. No offense but it wasn't exactly topical in the nursery. We are still paying off Reagan's debt. Clinton's 8 years saw the growth in debt dramatically reduce and actually start paying down the debt. Reagan/Bush one really dug a pretty good sized whole. -
Well you do have to take in the Cold War as a factor in that.
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O it isn't hate speech, it is just logical bashing towards your kind.
Weird how you never manage to make a logical argument then, isn't it? You just go straight for the schoolyard insults.
Seriously, you've got nothin' -- no game whatsoever. And there's no evidence that you even know what logic is. -
O please. I have stated my case Wisco, you just choose to ignore it. You just chime in with insults and then run away. figures
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Well, let's scroll back and see what that "case" was:
McCain sucked from the beginning
Wow, that is insightful. -
Yes it is. He was a horrible choice for a candidate.
"Weird how you never manage to make a logical argument then, isn't it? You just go straight for the schoolyard insults."
You directed this towards me, but in reality it is toward yourself. -
Okay... so your stance is:
- McCain sucked.
- Palin rules!
- Reagan ruled!
- Republicans are not Conservatives.
- Conservatives are not Republicans.
- Republicans put on a hoax to people that they are Conservatives.
- Liberalism should be compared to a facist government run state where people have very little opinion. (That's a funny one.)
- Bush has gone with the left for much of his Presidency. (I'd love to hear the explanation of that one.)
- You vote Republican because you hate Democrats. (Thought provoking.
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- Obama is full of crap and he only offers impending doom. (Doom, yet to be outlined.)
- You admire people like Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Michael Savage and you think divisive rhetoric from the right works.
Is that accurate? Care to add anything? - McCain sucked.
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The Geneva convention is a group, and international treaties aren't important.
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And he wishes the Confederacy won the Civil War.
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This is beautiful. You quote me as saying, "Weird how you never manage to make a logical argument then, isn't it? You just go straight for the schoolyard insults."
Then your answer to my post is "[McCain] was a horrible choice for a candidate." I'll ask again, do you even know what logic is?
That's not an argument, that's a declaration. By this same reasoning, I can "prove" that all conservatives belong to a death cult bent on destroying the world by just saying so. So I will.
There, I've proved it logically and conclusively. Conservatives belong to a death cult bent on destroying the world. Why do you hate the world?
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your still talking?
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Thanks for making my point.
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and your still talking? o i'm sorry i don't give much thought to constant insults. Why don't you just send me a private message and tell me how you really feel? yeah you do think conservatives belong to a death cult bent on destroying the world. You know that isn't true, but yet you say it to piss people off. here is your logic. You post pictures of trolls and yet you meet the criteria for one.
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Like I said, thanks for making my point. You don't have one, apparently. Unless we count the one under your hat.
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I have already stated it you idiot. Your are about the most ridiculous person on this sight for contradicting themselves.
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I went on a web sight to test my eye site.
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Your are so stewpid.
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