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Ireland ratifies the Lisbon Treaty

Posted by clioandme • 10/04/09 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Topics: eu, Ireland

Ireland finally ratified the Lisbon treaty yesterday. Will Europe now grow a backbone in terms of foreign policy? Is an actual pan-European state emerging? Or is this nothing more than a much-needed corrective to the current system grown too cumbersome by the EU's expansion?

Or maybe I'm putting the cart before the horse. There's still Poland to go, and who knows what Conservatives in Britain will get up to if they win the next election.

www.nytimes.com/2009/10/04/world/europe/04ireland.html?_r=1&ref=europe

User Comments

10/04/09

xmarks

I can't see adding Ireland will make much difference to EU policy. Ireland is likely joining mainly because they are really suffering economically (I believe unemployment is around 17%). The hope is that joining EU can give them a little economic uplift.

EU is actually surviving the recessions better than I thought they would. Additionally, will EU expansion stop with Europe Could they see adding asian, african or even south american countries to the mix.

[reply]
1. 10/04/09
  
  clioandme
  
  Ireland is not joining the EU. They've been in it for a long time. Ireland has now ratified the new treaty that is designed to give Europe a new constitution of sorts, at least in terms of the respective states' relationships to each another.
  
  There is a connection with the recession, though. The EU saved Ireland from collapse.
10/04/09

polybore

One thing that this vote does make highly likely is...

Tony Blair President of the European Union.

xmarks Ireland has not joined the EU as it has pretty much always been a member. This Lisbon Treaty thing is effectively a change to the EU constitution to reflect changed times ie the enlargement of the EU.

Depending on your view of the EU the Lisbon treaty is either just a bit of paperwork to tidy up the rules because there are more members or a step towards a United States of Europe.

In the UK the Conservatives are in a bit of a bind. They have a policy to put the Lisbon Treaty to a refferendum but only if, by the time the conservatives are in power, other countries have rejected the Lisbon Treaty.

With Ireland having ratified this leaves Checkoslovakia and Poland as the only ones not to do so and it would be a suprise if they were not to.

[reply]
1. 10/04/09
  
  clioandme
  
  I forgot about the Czech Republic, whose president seems to be an old school nationalist.
  
  As far as Britain goes, doesn't the new constitution give more power to the bigger member states? If so, wouldn't that make it easier for Britain to swallow?
2. 10/04/09
  
  polybore
  
  It is not so much a question of Britain swallowing the Lisbon Treaty (interesting image) but the Conservative Party swallowing it because they are very likely going to form the next government in around a years time.
  
  The Conservative Party has a self destruct button and it is labelled Europe. There are eurosceptic and europhile Tories. At the moment the infighting between the two has had a lid kept on it by a promise, when in government, to hold a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty, but only if the Lisbon Treaty has not been ratified by all nations and effectively becomes Law.
  
  The reason for this proviso is that the UK has already ratified the Lisbon Treaty (without a referendum) news.scotsman.com/world/UK-ratifies-Lisbon-Treaty-despite.4200308.jp
  
  If either Poland, Czechoslovakia or both do not ratify then while the Lisbon Treaty is not law the Conservatives can hold a referendum and use this as grounds for reversing the UK's existing ratification on the grounds that no referendum was held.
  
  If Poland and Czechoslovakia ratify then all nations including the UK will have ratified and the treaty will be passed. This would mean that the UK could not have a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty and the Tory and other eurosceptics will be furious.
  
  Of course the UK could hold a referendum, and the Euroscepics will push for one, but it would have to be a UK in or out of the EU as there is no way that the EU could tolerate a country going back on it's treaty obligations.
  
  At present the Tory Party refuses to answer the question as to what they will do if the treaty is passed. They say they don't need to answer until after Poland and Czechoslovakia have ratified. The truth is they cannot answer because a commitment to, either holding a referendum or not, after the treaty has passed has the capacity to blow the party apart as it did for Major and Thatcher.
3. 10/04/09
  
  polybore
  
  There is a potential filibuster like angle. Poland or Czechoslovakia holding off ratification until after the Conservatives are in power. Unlikely but not impossible. The pressure on Poland and Czechoslovakia to get on with it is going to be immense.
  
  As a footnote and from a Scottish perspective...
  
  If the treaty is passed and the Conservative Party is pushed into holding an EU In or Out referendum, which is possible as the UK Independence Party could really damage their vote at the General Election, then the vote could be very close.
  
  If it were Out it would be quickly followed by a referendum in Scotland on In or Out of the UK and if Out then Scotland would apply to join the EU as an independent country.
  
  Scotland has close ties with Europe and is more likely to vote Yes to independence under a Conservative Government as it would be dominated by English MP's.
10/04/09

Agit8r

We should all be outraged! This is what happens when our president takes a hands-off approach to the evil socialist empire over there!

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